Thank you for watching. The hotel is not alone here, you know, coming out of the whole COVID thing and all the supply chain problems. If you're wanting a wing or a harness or anything, pretty much across the brands, as I understand it, the wait times right now are really, really long. So be thinking about that. If you're hoping to get something for this summer, you're probably already too late. So just be thinking about that. And whoever you get your gear from, reach out and get stuff, get in the queue, get in the line.
Because I know a lot of people are pretty disappointed. They're not going to be able to get their stuff for comps that they have this season and that kind of thing. So that's just the nature of the beast right now. The other thing I wanted to mention Skysight. We did a podcast with Matt, the main developer there, quite a while back. And I have been using this platform a lot more lately. And it's just absolutely terrific. So I just wanted to give them a little bit of a shout out. Their models are fantastic. We used them a lot in the ex-Alps. And I've been thinking about them lately because my guest today is Benjamin Kellett down in New Zealand. He makes these incredible films. Go to the show notes to find all the links, but look them up on YouTube.
He makes these amazing films about his bivvy trips down in the Southern Alps, down in New Zealand. And really good instructional stuff and amazing audio. He's a terrific filmmaker. And he's a great guy. He's a great editor. So the talk I had with him is great. But you'll hear in the show, we talk about SkySight quite a bit. And it's one of the forecasting tools he really relies on down there. So check it out. SkySight.io. And let's get into this talk with Benjamin. Benjamin came onto my radar because of our editor, Miles Connolly, and said, Hey, man, you've got to check this guy out. He's doing some really cool stuff. And I looked him up on YouTube and got sucked into the vogue.
And he is crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy crazy So we talk about his gear and how he forecasts and how he approaches Bivy, how he got into it, and where he's going. And it's a lot of fun. So enjoy this talk with, actually, I was going to say Kiwi, but he's not. He's a Brit, but he's been down in New Zealand for a long time now.
And enjoy this talk with Benjamin Kellett. Cheers.
Benjamin, great to have you on the show. I'm really excited that our editor, Miles, put me on to you because it sucked me down the rabbit hole watching all your films. Fantastic stuff, man. And I've been in that side of the game a little bit, too. Not as much in the creation side like you have, but I know how difficult that is. And I understand you're doing all your own editing. And we'll have the links up, obviously, in the show notes to your films. And thank you. So our listeners can go and watch what you've been doing down in New Zealand. But fantastic stuff. And really excited to talk to you.
Oh, thanks, mate. Thanks for having us on. And yeah, I mean, you don't know this, but you've been my hiking companion for many years now. And yeah, what you're doing is amazing. So yeah, I'm really stoked to be a part of it. So thanks for having me on.
Oh, wicked. Well, you know where I thought we'd start, because I don't know it. Tell me your history of flying. How'd you get into this? How long you been doing it? And when did you start making the films?
So I couldn't really tell you why I started paragliding. It was kind of just one of those things that just happened. You know, like, I think I just had some. Yeah, I did know absolutely no research. I hadn't really no idea about it. I didn't know you could fly cross country or any of this stuff. In the beginning, I just thought it was sled rides, you know. So, I mean, it was seven years ago. I'm living in Queenstown. And obviously, there's a lot of tandem flying here. So I see them flying off the gondola and all of this. And I think I just had like, you know, I had this spare. They're 250 bucks one day and I needed a new hobby. It's summer. So I go out to Flight Park, which is our local spot, and did the intro day. The intro day, they just sort of teach you to launch and land. You know, it's just an introductory. And at the end of the day, they go, well, if you come back tomorrow, you can fly off Coronet Peak.
I'm like, oh, well, I'm going to do that. I'm going to come back and fly off Coronet Peak. That's got to happen. And then that just totally got me. And throughout the rest of the course, yeah, I just, you know, learned more and more and more. And they told me, oh, you can do this. You can do aerobatics. You can fly long distance and you can access these cool places and can go up to the cloud. I'm like, oh, well, this is me. I'm set. This is wicked. But yeah, like I learned in New Zealand. I'm originally from the UK. So yeah, some might pick up. I've got a bit of a mongrel accent at times. Yeah, I moved here when I was. Yeah, yeah. I moved here when I started saying yeah, nah, yeah, nah and stuff like that. That'll be why. But yeah, I moved here when I was. I was 19. So I've been here knocking on 11 years now. I originally came here to snowboard.
But, you know, so skateboarding led me to snowboarding. Snowboarding brought me to the mountains and the mountains gave me paragliding. But yeah. Yeah, full blown home now. I
recognize Coronet Peak right off the bat. Because when I was young, I was really into ski racing. And that's one of my fondest memories was skiing Coronet Peak. Do you guys remember? Do you remember one of New Zealand's most famous races? There was a guy named Simon Wyrutny. Oh, yeah. He was on the national team for a bunch of years. Just a mad skier. He was insanely fast. And I got to follow him down Coronet Peak.
Oh, epic.
Years ago. Yeah. A bunch of air. It was fantastic. But I wasn't a pilot then. And that's what struck me in your videos was I, you know, I wasn't a pilot when I was in New Zealand. It was a long time ago. But it was you can top land anywhere. Yeah. It just looks terrific. Yeah. And I think it's because of the weather. I didn't realize that. I mean, I've, you know, I saw Nick Nain and stuff. And I've seen people doing these, you know, really cool south to north traverses kind of thing. But I didn't realize the terrain was so, I always think of New Zealand as being treed and wet.
It depends which side of the divide you're on. But, yeah, certainly the west of the divide is very wet. And we get predominantly the west. So, you know, we've got a lot of weather coming from the west. And it all sort of dumps on the west coast. And it's a bit of a jungle out there. But east of the divide, which is most of the island, is totally fine. I mean, there are some areas further north where you've got some more pine trees. And there are some areas where there's some beach trees. But certainly the bush line sits up at like 1,500 meters. So, even where there is trees and stuff, you can totally land, top land and camp and keep going. The only thing that holds us back is the weather. I mean, at the end of the day, we are a mountainous country that's just sort of risen out of the sea. So, it does get complex at times. And you can get some gnarly sea breezes and things like that. And we don't often get really long stretches of good weather.
But certainly there's some like three or four days. And it's just brilliant. Yeah, it is really a great place for Volvid, you know. And I think New Zealand will naturally sort of breed Volvid pilots. Because in order to do good distance here, you kind of have to fly into terrain that requires you to be prepared to stay out for a few nights. You know, so if you want to do some big cross country, start getting the gear and thinking about it. Even if you're not inclined to do Volvid in the first place. And before you know it, you're doing Volvid and you're having the best time. And there's a really good crew and the scene is growing here massively, which is really exciting.
That's really exciting. So, there's more and more pilots every year. It's a growing sport in New Zealand?
Exponentially. Like, well, say specifically with Volvid. So, yeah, we're increasing pilot numbers. But what's really happening. And especially. We can thank COVID for this a lot. Is that a lot of people have got more spare time now. So, we've got a lot of tandem pilots that work here. A lot of people that work in the industry. And a lot of people who fly that maybe got full-time jobs. But with all their extra time now. And, you know, New Zealand's been locked off to the rest of the world for a couple of years. You know, we've been a bit of a hermit country. So, the tourism industry has died. And everyone's just got this extra time. And everyone's just sending it out the back. It's great. So, the level of the pilot is exponential. So, you know. If you go back. Tim Percival. He's on the committee here.
He put a really interesting article up in our magazine, Airborne. And he's comparing statistics of our community year on year. And the distance in which everybody's flying. And it's just going through the roof. Everyone's just improving and skilling up. And having a blast. So, yeah. Yeah. It's pretty exciting to see. It's pretty exciting to be a part of. And, yeah. The community's in really good health.
Did you get any feedback from the community? Aw ya ya ya
ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya ya areas that I had to walk for for long periods and I thought you know what am I like spending the rest of the day walking out this is a pretty cool campsite you know like you probably just stay here and do it and then you start thinking what really got me into Volpe as well is that there was places that I wanted to fly and they seemed really cool and and and but they're quite remote so you have to be prepared so you just start getting the gear and and then you go and then do you know what what I'm going to do today is I'm planning I'm going to go and stay out and and that completely changed my mentality and that's been a big step for people flying cross country here is that if you stop worrying about bombing out in the back and having to walk for days and start thinking I'm going to go and bomb out the back and get a camping and it's going to be awesome then you most likely just fly right through there and you know and you're just not thinking about it anymore and it really changes the way we fly and that's kind of what happened to me um I started going I want to go camping and then those two things happened together and then I started flying further and further and then the adventure just got bigger and bigger for
for those who haven't flown in New Zealand we were talking before we started recording you were saying about the remoteness that you know it's the South Island is quite a bit more remote than than the North but yeah you were saying you don't really ever get too far away from towns villages yeah
exactly I mean like you can quite easily like there's not many towns and villages there's not really any public transport there's no trains there's no real bus services apart from the city there's no public transport there's no public transport there's no public transport there's no public transport there's no public transport there's no public
transport there's no public transport there's no public transport there's no public transport ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know ya know There's huts, there's plenty of huts around that are all, you know, some of them are spectacular, some of them have got heaps of character and most huts are sort of one day's walk in between each one. So there are facilities, but yeah, for me, it's, you're exposed, but not like, you know, we're not flying in Pakistan.
It's, yeah, it's exciting.
Your videos do a really good job of describing this, but how do you plan these trips? Are you literally just launching from Queenstown and flying the weather and where you end up is where you end up? Or have you typically got more of an objective?
Yeah, so yeah, it's really, it's just to the weather, but in the sense that I do plan the flights beforehand and I have an idea of the direction in which I want to go. And which areas I think are good. And that plays a part in, you know, like you sort of take that into account on the day and it's sort of translating the forecast into what's really going on. But I'll, you know, I spend sometimes, and especially, especially at the beginning of the season when I'm really hungry for it, I'll spend a lot of time planning and I'll spend, you know, days before. And I sometimes, I have a joke with my mates. They're like, where are you going flying? I'm like, I don't know. I haven't looked at the forecast for eight hours yet. And I'll, you know, like I've still got another six to go. But yeah, I'll pour over it a lot because, you know, that's the thing because it's such a, it's a small island and it feels like quite a technical flying place.
Is that some areas can be extra. Excellent. And then just, you know, the next valley over can be quite different and not very good. So I'll pick the area that I think is really good. And on the day, just go with it and go and see how far I'll have like a best expectations and a worst. I'll say, you know, like worst case scenario, I'm going to take off from Coronet peak and I'm going to glide to the next mountain and we'll walk up it and I'm going to camp. Cool. That's a good trip. What's better than that? Well, the next mountain and the next mountain after that. And then, well, what if I get to this place? I mean, I mean, you know, and you sort of start, you know, it's kind of a normal. Thing, I guess, but plan for the, what seems unachievable and anything in between is just. Yeah,
it goes. Yeah. What are you using for forecasting?
Skyside. Yeah. Mostly Skyside. So, yeah, I've used some of the other, I use a bit of, bit of windy for general airflow, but more and more I'm just relying on Skyside, which does a pretty good job here. I mean, it's like anything, it's not completely foolproof, but it is, it's pretty spot on most of the time.
And do you use their, just their model? Or are you using, are you, do you have HR three down there too? Um,
I just use their model. Yeah. Yeah. No, I don't, I don't swap between models on that one. I do on windy. You can, it's quite easy to jump between the two, but yeah. Skyside. I just use that.
And then once you're, once you're out of Queenstown, is your cell, do you have pretty decent cell coverage where you go in these places? Are you, are you then relying on in reach?
Oh, in reach. Yeah. Um, you get cell reception when you're above. So two and a half thousand meters in, in most places. But yeah, as soon as literally, I mean, as soon as you walk around the back of Coronet peak, it's, you've got no, yeah. Even on the summit, you don't, you don't have. That's it. Yeah. Yeah.
So, so forecasting wise, are you say you're going out for a three day when you leave Coronet, you've got, you know, pretty good forecast, but it starts to deteriorate as the days go by. Are you having people sending you messages on in reach to give you updates or are you just looking at the sky?
Yeah. A bit of both really. So I, I usually. Um, we'll have a pretty detailed look at the forecast before I go. Sometimes I'll take screenshots. Um, but I just usually try and memorize it and then, but like, like anything, any forecast anywhere, probably the, um, the forecast changes and it can change rapidly. So I usually just get updates sent to the inner reach that, um, uh, mostly for safety. Um, and some in some aspects towards instability and potential, but mostly like what's the wind strength on the. Surface. What's the wind strength up high. Um, am I going to get any gnarly sea breezes and does it look on for me to keep going? And it usually that forecast will fit inside 160 character text. It just gives me a bit of a gist.
And then with that, I'll just go with the day, but some, sometimes I'll, I'll be flying and, um, you know, just before I start falling, you know, lower or I'm thinking I'm getting near the end of the day. I might give a mate a ring and see if they can screenshot some stuff and send it to me. I've done that in the past. And that's been, been super helpful. I've got some mates at work who are watching the tracker and stuff.
Are you, is New Zealand really prone on the South Island, you know, on the sunny days is a, is a sea breeze effect almost guaranteed.
Yeah, not every day, but most days, um, it's a bit of a trick to try and predict which side of the island it's going to come from. It does kind of depend on where you are and, and there's some aspects to it that I don't really fully understand myself, um, with the, you know, high pressure on low pressure on which side of the island. But generally. Speaking, you can say that the sea breeze in Queenstown is always going to come from the South and what time it comes through will vary day to day, but on the really big unstable days, you get strong sea breezes, which are gnarly if you're away from the divide. But at the same time, and this is something which is, um, I've really over the last few years, that's been a bit of a light bulb moment with, with my own flying is using those to, to extend the day rather than end of the day. Cause we get some pretty cool convergences that, that happen out here.
And a lot of those. Those are triggered from sea breezes, but yeah, you get in sometimes in the valleys and often the valleys are quite wide. Um, so it's not overly dangerous. I mean, as long as you can land backwards in a paddock, you're pretty sweet. Yeah, you can, you can, you definitely put you on the deck if you don't use it in the right way, but we get easterly coming up through a Marama and that, and that feeds a beautiful convergence that leads up towards the Benno house in the direction of Mount Cook. Yeah. It's a pretty interesting spot.
Hmm. You said that you said the sea breezes are. Much stronger when you get away from the device. So they're, when you're saying they're, they're really strong out in the flats and when you're up in the mountains, they'll kind of split it.
Yeah. Well, sort of where the Mount, so they are strung out in the flats. Um, so you've got some areas where you kind of have foothills that lead up towards the main. Mountains and at the mouth of the mountains where it all starts and they get, you get them squeeze points, which aren't generally close to the divide. So my general tactic to try and avoid getting decked in the sea breeze. Yeah. Is to just push away from the coast and get close to the divide. The closer you get to the divide, I find that the more chance you get of, um, linking into some kind of convergence or actually weakens out. Sometimes they do come all the way up the valleys all the way to the head, but usually by then you should be able to. But yeah, there are some valleys that you'd certainly want to stick away from because they get pretty narrow, even at the mouth of them and for the length of them.
But well,
tell me about your kit. I, we should have prepared this in advance so you could look at a list or something, but maybe you've got it memorized. But what, what, what's your typical kit and be real detailed about, you know, when you go off for three, you know, your, your typical kind of triangle bivy.
Yeah. Okay. So, um, it does vary, um, as it probably does with everyone, but, um, you know, like if I'm like, if I'm going for like three, sort of three days, obviously in reaches a mass, like I wouldn't, and that's one of the things and that, and just, just as a side note, that's something that, um, there's really changed in the community here. Yeah. Yeah.
There is still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still still This is one of my more luxury items. I've definitely spent a bit of weight on having a nice tent. I'm with you, man. I like a big
tent. I like to be able to sit up. Totally. Yeah, I
dig it. I want a house. Yeah, exactly. It's my chateau. It's chateau. Yeah. I like to have my gear out. I like to be able to pack up my gear inside my tent. I like to sit in there and make food. For me, it's about having a good time. If I'm not having a good time, I'm like, what am I up to? I'm suffering. I'm getting covered in mildew and condensation. I'm drying gear out and I can't. It's hard. Yeah, I spend a bit of extra weight on the tent. I take a sleeping bag. Sometimes, mid to late summer, I don't bother because wrapping up in the glider is absolutely fine. Sometimes, you just don't need it. Thermarest or an inflatable mattress, a lightweight inflatable mattress. Then, what else do I take?
Yeah. You take a stove or you just
make fire?
No, no. I take a stove. I've got one of those tiny BRS. You can get them on AliExpress. They weigh 28 grams and they just screw to the top of a butane, the little gas canisters.
Yeah. MSR has one of those too. They're great.
Yeah. They weigh nothing. To be honest with you, I bought it three years ago and I was expecting it to break almost immediately because it's pretty fragile, but it's lasted this whole time, which is incredible.
Yeah. I've got the same one. Those are great. I've been using it for years. Yeah.
I use that and I've got a little 750 mil titanium cup and I take with me. Food-wise, yeah, it kind of depends on the mood sometimes. Sometimes, I don't take the stove. I just take wraps and cheese and salamis and things, but more often, especially this season, I've been taking instant mashed potatoes being my go-to. It's super cheap, super easy. You don't have to wait for it to cook and I just throw brie in it and salami and pesto and things like that. Yeah. Noodles. And things like that. But I just really like having a hot meal and I'm out the back. It's something to do. It's enjoyable. So, yeah, I like taking the stove. I can make coffee and things like that.
Yeah. I often find on Bibby's, you can do the little morning slutter, but you can also just sit there for four hours, let it warm up and have a really nice time. If you've got your espresso, your little thing for making some coffee and you've got a little book or some podcast or whatever downloaded, then I don't know. I like chilling.
No. No. Not very often that I'll make a sled ride in order to walk up the next hill. Like I'll totally opt. If I have to, if I slope land the day before and I land halfway, I'll use that morning to walk to the top. So I've got the best chance and then I'll chill at the top and make breakfast and stuff like that. But if I'm already on the top, I'm just going to kick it and make some food and enjoy myself. Yeah. In terms of other kit. Yeah. Fly. Use the XC Racer. I take a lot of. Power. What I do for power is mostly I'm just going for sort of two or three days. So I just take power banks. I don't really run the solar too much. I have done it a bunch of times, but for me, like, I mean, if I was going for longer than three days, I'd take it.
But here for New Zealand, especially to get more than three days of flyable weather in a row, usually you'll get three good days and then you'll get three bad days. And by that time, usually I check out. I've had my fun. So I just take power banks. And to be honest with you, because all the camera gear, especially like last season, wasn't so bad because I wasn't running a 360 camera, but this, this year I do about 10,000 milliamps per day. And that's just because I run a 360 for the whole flight. Most of the. So that's,
that's, you've got that plugged in. You're not, I mean, it's the, the cameras plugged into your battery bank the whole time.
Totally. Yeah. It would do maybe an hour and a half without the power bank. But it, it just chews through power. Like it's. Yeah. It works. Yeah. It works. It works. It works. It works. It works.
Anker, 10,000 milliamp. Yeah. Battery, you know, lithium battery.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So you'll go,
so you'll, you'll take three or four of those with you on a trip.
Yeah. So I've got one 20,000 and a 10,000 and I usually take that. If I've got solar, then some, then I'll take like two tens. But yeah, it's yeah, it's a bit of weight, a bit of weight there just in batteries, but then it's a bit weighting the camera gear too. You know, like there's definitely at least a kilo of, of camera gear.
Yeah. So you, I want to ask you about all that, but if we hit all the gear, any, do you take rain stuff? I'm trying to think of anything. Tarps.
Yeah. So I, sometimes I take, yeah, I based off the forecast. If I think it's going to rain or sometimes I start and it's raining because I'll spend a day hiking before. So I'll take a poncho. I've got one of those ultra light ponchos. It just goes, it sort of goes over the bag as well. So I don't have to have a bag cover too. And I find that just keeps my gear dryer as well. Cause even with the bag cover, it just sort of runs down. Your back and then goes through the harness through that backpack. Um, so I just use a, I use a poncho. Um, but sometimes a lot of the time I didn't need to take it. I don't pull it. Yeah. And, and, and some, and that's probably with all that, all of that stuff with sort of three days of food, um, the way I sit on the range is about a hundred percent of the range. And for here, I found the flying, um, being right at the top end is pretty nice. I quite like that. Um, but personally, I optimally like 75%.
So if I'm not planning. Uh, a night out, if I'm not going camping, then the gear, the kit sort of reduces and I stopped taking as much luxury items, you know, I might ditch the stove and just take muesli bars. I might, you know, ditch the sleeping bag. Sometimes I ditch a tent cause I know there's huts. Um, and that's more for just when I'm cross sort of cross country flying, but I'll have a baseline of gear that I'll always take, but I know that, you know, I'm not, maybe not going to have the best time, but it's going to be enough to keep me, you know, warm at night and able to walk and things like that.
Trekking poles. Yeah.
Yeah. I love them. I need it. I need all the help I can get really. Um, so I can't,
I can't even walk without trekking poles anymore. And what about how, how do you handle navigation? What are you using for mapping and down? Are you downloading maps in advance? What are you doing for that? What kind of stuff do you have on your phone?
So there's a really great app here. It's called the NZ topo 50. And, um, I'm pretty disappointed to find out that it's not an international cause it's really great. It's just a topographic. I've never heard of that. Oh, it's really, it's really
cool. It's really
good. Um, if anyone's coming to New Zealand to do bivy flying or cross country flying, download that app, it's about two gigabytes. Um, so it's quite a large app, but it basically has, um, it's the whole of the South and, and think the North Island just completely downloaded and you can zoom in and it tells you where all the walking tracks are, where all the huts are and all the contour lines and rivers and Bush and everything. It's really good. Um, but I mean, that's when I'm on the ground and sort of trying to find the best way to hike places and sort of scoping outlines for missions and things like that. I use that a lot. Um, but to be honest with you, I also just spend a lot of time, um, outside of flying, studying the areas and, and, and getting to know the terrain.
And, um, yeah, my, my mates take the piss out of me a lot because I know the names of most of the mountains and it's cause I hear that
in your videos. Jeez, man, this guy knows every single little pimple.
Yeah. It's funny. I dunno. I dunno. Maybe I've, I've got some level of autism or something. I dunno. Like I'm just somewhere on the spectrum in terms of geography. And, uh, I dunno when you're really passionate about something and you, and you, and you love something a lot and you, you know, I spend probably a little bit too much time looking at maps and dreaming up flights. Then you start learning all the names and it's, um, yeah, I get a bit excited in the videos and I start naming everything I can see, but yeah, it's, um, I, I, I learn the area.
This is a, this is an, I find this interesting. I think most people don't. Most people won't, but are you boots or tennis shoes?
Boots. Yeah. Boots. I'm boots. And I, to be honest with you, I think that's probably, um, it it's sensible for the terrain that we have here. Cause we don't have any trails really. Like there's some trails down in the valley floor, which could be suitable for sort of trainers. But, um, even those, a lot of the times you, you end up at a bog and you're going to go through the bog and then you got wet feet and, and you know, you're hiking up through Tussock and you're getting stuff in, in your shoes. I've just been boots. Yeah. And I find them nice for top landings as well.
Do you bring, do you bring a pair of real lightweight sandals or something with you just so you can get your feet out of the boots at night and stuff? No, it's pretty nice to walk around barefoot.
Totally. Exactly. Yeah. I just take the boots off. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Nice.
This'll, this'll make you upset knowing how much work you're putting into your editing and all that kind of thing. But all the big films I've done, we've always had a sound engineer take care of, you know, what you're doing really well. How are you getting such good sound?
Oh, thanks. Um, yeah, no, I just, I just run a lapel mic. Um, it took a bit of playing around, uh, just, uh, um, like a lap. Oh really? Yeah. So I'm out of the GoPro. So I have the, um, this kind of helps with the editing too. So, um, uh, the GoPro on the helmet, I've got a, it's a mic adapter, um, that you can buy from GoPro. And then I run a road lapel mic from the helmet cam down the shirt and I've got it on the chest. Yeah. I've got a wind fluffy on it, like a dead cat. And whenever I want to sort of do some narration or talking, I just turn on the camera, do some talking, have a look around, turn it off. And then when I go to edit later, I chuck it all in with the 360 footage and it matches up and yeah. And a little bit of magic in premiere, a couple of clicks, but it's, it's the, the real trick is using the lapel mic.
Um, cause it kind of sits on your chest. It's really good. Your sound is
amazing, man. It's like, it's like you're talking to your audience. It's, uh, that's something we have struggled with, but that's great. Yeah. Fantastic. I forgot to ask you wing and harness. That was the last bit of gear.
So I've, uh, I'm flying the zeolite GT, um, so lightweight two liner, um, which I totally love it, you know, like, and, um, yeah, um, it's super solid and it's, it's got the performance that you can push into wind and I feel really safe on it and yeah, it's a really great glider. Easy to launch and land. That's I think actually the most important as well is that, that you can put it into tight spots and get it out tight spots. So yeah, I'm really happy with that. The harness, um, I was using the Oseum and, uh, for, uh, you know, five, 600 hours. Then I did, um, the, uh, over the last season I did the F race, um, which worked really well. I was, you know, like, and for, for what it's designed for, which is essentially the XLs, it's quite lightweight.
It only weighs 1.5 kilos. I thought I was going to destroy it. In the first month, but it actually, you know, it held up really well. So that was great. And I had enough storage and that was cool. But now I've got the BB one, um, which is Ozone's new harness specifically for bivouac blind. And I'm pretty stoked with that. It's ticks all for me, it ticks all the boxes. It's got a ridiculous amount of storage and it seems clever enough that it's when all the storage has got this huge storage in the back and it's all side loaded. So you can inflate the back protection, lie the glider on its side and just keep throwing stuff in until you can't get it in anymore. And yeah, it's inflatable back. It's got a really nice back protection. So it packs down really small, um, really small pack volume and it weighs two kilos. So yeah, I've only just got it. I've been flying it for a week or so, but so far pretty stoked. Yeah.
Wow. That's really nice. That's always one of the things that makes me worry about bivy gear is when you, you know, typically you take the pad out to make all the room and then, you know, of course you're, you're taking on some risks there too. So it's quite nice to have an airbag solution.
Totally. And, and, and I think that's the future, you know, like, especially for the bivouac and things like that, because like you say, typically everyone just takes the foam out and you just put the sleeping bag and things under, under the seat where all the soft bit is. But, um, well I've managed to get all my kit into this and had still have full back protection. You could, if you wanted to thick sleeping bag, you can still do that. And then you just inflate the rest of the space. So I think for this style of flying inflatable back protection, I think is the way forward.
Right. And one of your videos, you were, I don't know, it was day two or something and you were, you were, you know, you'd spent the night and then the next day you rocked up at some comp that was going on. I thought that was really neat that there was, I'm going to go see what's going on with these guys. Yeah. Are you a comp pilot as well?
No, not really. I, competition's a tough one for me. Like I, I, I enjoy the city. It's more of a social event really for me. And then that's, um, it's great. It's great fun. Don't get me wrong. I really enjoy it, but I need to be careful sometimes. Cause I, I am a little bit competitive. Yeah. I want to be fun myself motivated in the right ways. And when I find myself motivated too much by the competition, then I kind of, sometimes I lose the buzz a little bit, but, um, yeah, I mean, I, I've done a few comps here and there cause I really like racing, racing your mates is heaps of fun. There's nothing better when you're side by side, your full bar and you just shout at each other. Like that's, that's awesome. I do, do really love it, but there, there's some sides of competitions that I'm not, I'm not too stoked about, but it's, um, that day was, that was just, I was just,
I was just
trying to make the most of the weekend, I guess. And, uh, I kind of managed to,
that'd be fun. Hey everybody. Um, the, you know, I haven't watched all your films, but I watched quite a few. Most of the time you're, you're solo. I mean, you're, you're often talking about, okay, well I've, I've, I'm missing, you know, somebody that this guy was here and I don't, I can't see him. I mean, obviously you're taking off with other people, but are most of your missions pretty solo oriented?
Yeah. I'd say 90%. Yeah. I'm not very good at flying with other people sometimes. You just get excited. I'm excited and fly off. But, um, yeah, often share the hike, you know, walk up together and share the drive and you know, everyone sort of flies off in different, a lot of people have got different objectives and uh, you know, sort of different levels of flying and, um, but yeah, most of the time it's on my own, but sometimes we do fly together and camp together and it's, and it's pretty awesome. We just did a really cool trip. Actually one of my favorite missions this season, we, we just took off from Coronet peak and the objective was just to stick together. Um, we had a group of four or five of us. And, um, we just wanted to stick together. Didn't matter how far we went. If we can fly 30 Ks, that'd be amazing. Um, but just go as a group camping and that was actually a really memorable trip. So yeah, maybe more, more of that to come.
What's your bivvy season. When does it start? When does it end? You know, for people listening that are just stoked and want to come down for a couple of weeks, what would be the most reliable time of the year?
Uh, the most reliable I'd say sort of mid sort of January through to end of February. I mean, it is still reliable in, in, in March. As well, but obviously the days are starting to get a little bit shorter, so the potential is a little bit less, but this, and it starts to get a little bit more stable, but, um, there's still some excellent days to be had in March. Um, the, so yeah, the longest days are obviously around the solstice, which is, um, the 21st of December. And those are our biggest flights, but December, December, it can be a bit of a wild month. The last few years it's been largely unflyable. Um, it starts getting thermic in sort of September time. And, uh, October. Yeah. So,
um, we've got some
pretty, pretty exciting flying in as well then in November, but it really starts getting good sort of mid to end December. Um, if it's not blown out in January, that's the best.
The island itself is, you know, it's, it's not huge. Um, but the, but it, there's a lot going on. I mean, in terms of geography and like you said, the West and the East and, um, how much, and I know that there's, there's been quite a few people that have done kind of the island bivy, you know, the, you know, covered the, the, the solstice.
There is
still quite a little bit of rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There
is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. There is still quite a little rain here. flown um or at least not on any with any sort of track log in the last 20 years that's mostly because of its inaccessibility and there's just nowhere to land or take off you know like this large so is that the west side yeah there's parts of the west side um and the south in the deep south and the fjord um there's areas that are pretty much with yeah it's almost like suicide flying but um but there are areas and especially um just north of mount cook where only a hand you know not many people have flown they're pretty you know there's some people that have flown through there on these on these trips and nick nick's obviously um an og who's been in most places and um there's a few others but yeah um there's a lot of it is is still unflown and or very rarely flown you know you get though that app what's that app you know in the cross country um planner where you can oh the sky tracks when you can look at sky tracks and see where people have been yeah sometimes i go on that and just go where's no one been before why not or why can't we go there just
nothing yeah yeah wow that's that's pretty exciting anything being done on
the north island i haven't done yeah there is it's not it's not as much flying going on up there from what i understand i personally haven't done any flying in the north island um it's not as mountainous um it's more sort of a flatlandy sort of place but they still do get some good flying up there um but i mean if you if you look at the what people are uploading to x contest and that i'd say maybe more or all in the in the south and and the majority of them around the queenstown monica area i i personally and it's hard for me to say because i haven't done really any flying up in the north island but um i think the best area for for flying is in the queenstown monica area and
wait but they have that comp uh what's the volcano the the mordor on the north island what's that place called oh you
put me on the spot here i'm gonna be embarrassed in front of all my kiwi mates let's just call it mordor right right right you
know what i'm talking about right yeah yeah yeah it's i don't know again i was there before my flying years but it's uh but don't they have a comp there what's that place called i want to call it fongaree but that's way farther north
no yeah that's cool i'm gonna embarrass myself it's probably taranaki or taupo or something like that oh
there you go yeah it's taupo taupo town and then taranaki can we edit
that so that it sounded like i knew what i was talking about i know absolutely that that stays in
it's all right man you're still a brit you're still a brit
because they have a con isn't that where new zealand nationals typically is or is it down where you are
no typically um yeah we didn't have it this year but um it moves around um i've not heard of a comp being there probably was but um we've had it in nelson a lot nelson's a pretty consistent place for comp flying we've had it in monica as well that was pretty exciting um but yeah it does move around yeah
so this season is just ending uh for you i guess down there but what's what do you start dreaming of this winter what are you going to be thinking you know where what does next year look like i mean hopefully things are going to be opening back up again for you guys and you can yeah escape and stuff but
exactly well we're we're being set free in fact we've been set free now um which is awesome so for me personally i'm gonna be i'm gonna be off to europe i've never flown in the alps before so yeah i'm gonna go and see my family in england
and i'm gonna be in england and i'm gonna be in
england because there's a long overdue visit um i'm really looking forward to doing some flying back in the uk um it's gonna be yeah that'll be quite special for me because obviously i've done i've flown for years and i've grew up in england and i've always seen it as this two-dimensional place and it'd be pretty cool to go back and fly and land in my village and go to the pub oh dude
you're gonna love the lakes i mean it looks a lot like what you're flying down there the lakes are spectacular and it again you can top land anywhere it's all just tussock and grass
yeah yeah i'm pretty stoked about that and yes i'm gonna do a month there and then i'm gonna go to europe and fly in the alps and go to switzerland and france and austria go see some friends and yeah i'm pretty stoked to go and fly there because i've heard it's pretty scenic
oh you're gonna love it yeah i mean that'd be fantastic i mean you're spoiled but you'll you'll love it there yeah um okay i got you distracted talking about this other stuff but i want to hear more about how you're filming so you've got the gopro you've obviously got one on a stick are you doing you switching it back and forth between the kind of pov on your helmet and putting it just you got two yeah
so i run the 360 camera for the whole flight um that means i can use that footage for um hyperlapses and um which you get some quite nice visualizations from the cloud formations and when you're running cloud streets and uh and then i run the gopro on on the helmet and yeah like with the running the 360 the whole time it's it's definitely um it's a huge file size i mean it films at 5.7k um for sometimes seven eight hours and it's it's a quite a bit of work to process all of that footage sometimes but it out it outputs at 1080 um and so i'll sort of keyframe all of that that footage in the direction that i want and and then i'll just link it with the gopro footage and kind of sort of do jump cuts between the two so um it also serves the gopro service a purpose for the audio as well as um as sort of a point of view yeah it
is are the videos is this because it's a lot of work to do and because it's a lot of work to do and because it's a lot of work to do and because it's a lot of work to do and because it's a lot of work to do and because it's a lot of work to do yeah not
not not um in the sense of my time um that goes into it no it is definitely a passion project uh but i mean it it's it's still a very small small channel and um you know um it at the moment it's just sort of started paying for the money that i put in for subscriptions on a monthly basis to to create the videos but outside of that not really it's just something that's i do for fun because
they're really instructional i mean there there's uh you know it was it was quite fun i mean i kind of figure i you know i know a lot about baby i've done a lot of baby flying and stuff but i really enjoyed the uh the pace the stoke you know you're you seem like a constantly optimistic kind of happy bloke and so you're you're having a really good time out there uh i i agreed with with miles our editor is that man you gotta watch this guy he's having a blast he's like you're having a lot of fun but it's also i appreciate the instructional aspect of it um it seems to come quite natural to you yeah
i mean i mean as much as i love love flying paraglides and doing bivy flights and and that i also love talking about it so i kind of ends up in the videos where i just end up rambling on but um yeah no i i i really love it i'm i'm really passionate about it and when you're passionate about something then it's quite easy to sort of put that kind of effort into stuff and it really for me like it it's awesome to see the stoke out of people and you know when you know some people they they they take something away from it and they realize that you know what this is possible i can do that look he's doing it i can see how he's doing it i can see the video i know what it looks like out there i kind of get a feel for the experience and that and and totally that's something that i took away from from next videos um when i was learning like i was watching videos of nick flying out the back and i'm like wow like that's so cool like i want to do that like and i i kind of understand what it looks
like and
i'm like oh my god i'm gonna do
that and
i'm like oh my god i'm gonna do that and i'm like
i can't do that i can't do that i can't
do that i can't do that i can't do that i can't do that i watched
next videos a hundred times it's you know so it's yeah if i can share the stoke and you know put some fire in people to go out there and get amongst it then that's just that's what it's all about really what
are your personal goals you you said that uh with flying and and maybe otherwise maybe with filmmaking yeah
um i'd love to i mean with with with flying i'd love to just keep progressing and just keep um i really at the moment the the forefront is just going to fly new places i love flying in new zealand it's spectacular but i've you know i've poured a lot of energy and sort of into into flying here now i'm pretty excited to go and fly somewhere where i don't know the names of all the mountains so do a bit of traveling go and see some new places um fly some new spots meet some new people and you know and um i'll keep making videos for sure um keep collecting collecting footage i'd love to keep improving um the videos and the video quality and um it's uh yeah that's something i'd like to expand i'd love to try and do some bigger um sort of expedition style bivy flying that would probably be the next personal goal for me is to try and go to somewhere that i haven't been before and just go really experience it by going for for some longer trips maybe as a part of a team or something like that and try and capture that and present that as maybe more of a longer form video rather than just sort of short of all big trips we
we had an email exchange a while back and he said you know i apologize because i couldn't i couldn't make it or something and you said uh it's no problem man i've got eight terabytes of footage to go through and i kind of laugh you know we had i think with alaska we had 60 something hours which turns into a 50 minute film and it was it was that kind of footage it was that kind of file size because they're shooting with red cameras and stuff but man you are shooting a lot of i mean eight terabytes that's a lot yeah ton of footage
it's it's mostly down to the 360 because it just it chews data and it chews power um but yeah it's a lot and it's a lot to go through you know i've gotten faster at it but it still takes time but yeah i've got i've got plenty of videos to get through i'm just uh slowly chipping away at them but uh give
the audience an idea so for one of your five minute films are or some of them are 20 and they're amazing very very watchable how much how much time is editing and it goes into one of those i
think the fastest time i did one was like one full 12 hour day um and still it's not bad yeah and then sometimes the longer ones will take sort of five days you know you know just you know and it's a this is the thing there's not a straight answer to that because it's a rabbit hole as i'm sure you're aware oh
you can always make it better oh
you just at some point and i used to i used to put a time limit on myself i used to say okay right once you get to this point just stop you know and move on to the next one and just try to keep improving but um when i'm trying to constantly keep improving you end up just spending more and more time and and then sometimes i'm just like into an animation i'm trying to get perfect but yes it's it's a bit of a rabbit hole yeah yeah okay
on that note i'm going to ask you one of the survey questions that we got last year uh has flying made other aspects of your life better or worse uh
well i'm i'm a single dude i've got no kids so i can't really say that the family life has it's been affected so
yeah i was gonna say it might might not be able to buddy with that kind of editing
no exactly i mean yeah with that or maybe maybe it's just you know that's one of the reasons as one of the many reasons i'm single i'm sure because i don't have time but uh um no i i can't think i mean i yeah my career in cookery probably suffered because i quit my job but yeah other than that it's been really fulfilling and an amazing experience so yeah i wouldn't swap it for anything are
you a chef yeah
i worked as a chef for about 10 years um which is
a really good thing i've been doing for a long time i've been doing a lot of work
which which wow my
last podcast was with the chef that's amazing back to back yeah crazy yeah
um it's actually a not bad and not bad of an industry to be in if you want to do a lot of flying and cross country flying especially if you work in a place that is somewhat flexible and has a bit of a bigger team and you can swap your shift around but like oh you know the previous years i'll you know go out and i'll i used to actually have such a laugh with this and it helps when you don't mind so much if you do get the sack but um like taking the challenge on if i've got work at five o 'clock and i'll go up coronet peak and i'll try and nut out 100k triangle and get back and then go to work and uh and you spend the whole day and the whole from the minute you did this a few times and it was it was really great fun you take from the minute you take off you can't bomb out until you make it home again if you bomb out you're missing your shift and you know you spend five six hours flying around the back you get back and you get to work and you're 15 minutes late and they're how was your day i'm like oh you guys have no idea
it was better than yours i guarantee it yeah but
you know like you know it does work even if i run out from like because we've got a gondola in queenstown and if i'm working the day shift i can you know sort of run out go and do an acro lap off the gondola and go back to work and you know that's that's so the sheet perfect but um yeah yeah i did that for a while but now yeah and i'm flying a bit of tandem now and a bit of a part-time job so
the back to the back to the bivy stuff i mean the terrain the terrain does look pretty tenable you know you can top land anywhere the valleys look pretty nice you know it seemed kind of alps-esque obviously without all the lifts although you would at cornet but you know it seems pretty tame but what would you what would what were some of the things early on that you know maybe caught you out a little bit or what would be the things that you know for folks that are listening that haven't yet done their first bivy what are the skills that you feel like are kind of baseline what are the what are the things that you feel like you should really kind of get into bivy if any yeah
i mean specifically for new zealand i'd say fitness um would be be the key one because you've got to do a bit of walking if it doesn't get a plan i mean obviously that doesn't make a difference so much elsewhere um yeah i don't i don't know just just keeping the expectations low and then you know when you when you because if you have to if you're way too ambitious you know i want to do 100k a day and i want to make it to here that you you're missing the point of it like you know so you've
got to
it's about the trip it's about the journey it's about the adventure so um you know you get fired up for just doing a sled ride and going camping and then if you get a thermal then wow this is just next level um you know and i'd recommend anyone who who haven't been bivy flying before is just take it down to its most simplest form in the beginning just walk up a hill camp at the top and fly down in the morning you'll figure out so much just from doing that where my gear fits in the bag what i need what i don't need what i don't need what i don't need what i don't need what i don't need you know all of that sort of thing um yeah i think that's a really good thing to do as this but don't don't try and run before you can walk basically um is a good move but yeah also just and knowing where you're going having a good idea of the terrain and the topography and which value is good which one's bad and having maps and an in-reach if you don't have phone signal like having the right gear yeah being prepared will
you be doing a lot of bivy flying when you're in the alps or is this more friends trip and flying you know the established sites yeah
a bit both um i'd you know i'd like to definitely going to be doing some bivy flying for sure um what that objective is is a bit unknown at the moment like i know we're meeting a group of mates in annecy um in june and we're going to try and sort of fly east um but how am i just being a bit of a paragliding tourist you know like i just want to fly to the i want to get a mont blanc i want to get at the aigo i want to get a dolomite and maybe i'll just do a zigzag around with my backpack and yeah i i'm really i'm looking forward to flying some acro as well and going and flying the gondolas because that's something that we struggle with here like getting over over water um is is quite hard because we've got lots of lakes and we've got mountains and but we don't have any roads really that go to the tops of the mountains especially near the lakes and we started towing recently which has been epic that's been really good but yeah i'm i'm really looking forward to just sort of use using all of the facilities available in the alps and top landing at the i've heard they've got huts that sell beer on the tops of the mountains which is just incredible they're everywhere it's unreal
yeah it's it's uh it's there's it's very styly man yeah
so maybe i'll just take a credit card i'll leave all the tent and stuff at home and just you know go live the life it's
a pretty it's a pretty good place to just have a credit card and have a really really good time yeah i'm going to ask you just a few questions here as we wrap things up from this survey there's people gave me a bunch of questions that i i find just really fun um what would you like to see more of in our sport
um yeah um you're just well initially more people fly like just just the general growth um you know i don't know about you but sometimes i i look i think people have why are you why isn't everyone doing this it doesn't make sense to me like this is incredible like what's going on talk to people in the gut when you're hitchhiking and they don't even know what it is you know which is it's fun but you're like what go out and learn and go um so yeah initially that but also i'm
going to talk to
people in the
gut when you're hitchhiking and they don't even know what it is you know which is it's um more people
get getting uh better handling of their wing uh handling skills and whether that be in form of acro or training or just practice you know like um you know like getting getting more people to be be more in control of the glider and i think that that will really skill people up and give people confidence and yeah i think a lot of people neglect that which is um which i think is super important you know being able to you know do whatever you want with the wing quite forwards backwards whatever you
want to do and i think that's a really good thing to do and i think that's
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ya yeah i guess the most yeah for me in my my flying it'd be flying flying convergences and understanding what they are how to recognize them um is something that we get quite often here um and it's something that we need to learn more let's it's really good spot here for flying sailplanes um it's a bit of a mecca up in america and these guys and i've started and i actually kind of like stopped like got this knowledge from you know you learn this stuff from them but i fly a lot on airband and often i'll be on their channel and they'll go there's a beautiful convergence setting up here i'm like oh where is it and then you you know and i sort of started figuring more of it out and understanding more of it but when i can sort of knowing when to turn and when you don't need to turn and when when you when i found a convergence line and it runs for 30ks i'm like boom that's it we're on and i don't have to turn and i can just keep going and that really extends the day and i've done that and and knowing when i can climb up the sides of and and and i've done that a few times a season in the same sort of places and i've started to go like ah this is this magic thing that just gives me this 30k boost like sonic the hedgehog you know i'm just like zip along and i don't have to turn so yeah like understanding when i have to turn and when i don't and using those lines it's been a bit of a are you
seeing that are you seeing these set up because Skysight is is quite good at picking out convergence because they obviously it's built for sailplanes are you
seeing that you're seeing that you're seeing that you're are
you finding that mapping pretty well to what you're experiencing in the real world
yeah absolutely and that's that's that's a that's a part of um my you know pre-flight forecasting sort of plan is looking um not only at where the good thermals are and where they're they're high and strong but also where the convergence line is and that's something to look at with the sea breeze where it's going to come through and where they're going to set up but um often Skysight you might you know might not be exactly where it says it is but it will be close enough and it might not be there quite on time you know but you get an idea if there's a you know if they say like oh there's going to be a big there's a big patch here that it's likely going to converge then it's usually it's usually there and within half an hour of an hour um but um it's it's it's more as well especially for specifically flying here is understanding where they commonly occur looking out for them and understanding okay well that's where it normally happens and then you sort of get to the day and you see the cloud and you're like oh that's the cloud and then you're like oh that's it yeah cool and go for it um yeah but Skysight does a good job of forecasting it which is pretty cool and some of it are really small as well because you get what's quite common here is that you know just on one side of um one of the range the air mass is completely different you can be cruising up at 9 000 feet up the shot over and then you get into the matuki which is the next valley behind out of the shot over and it's down at five but it's where those two meet and over those ranges is where you get the Skysight and then you get to the next valley behind and some of the best climbs and it's quite spectacular because you're flying up at 9 000 feet looking down at cloud but it's sort of looking at that that imaginary line in between the two and and Skysight picks that quite well
amazing yeah that's cool best tip you've gotten from a mentor or buddy instructor somebody you've flown with over the years the thing something you've kind of gone back to again and again just man that was good advice yeah
um i guess um a lot of people have told me just to slow down and and um don't you know like there's other days you know like there's no need to push it on the gnarly days if it's not the day it's not the day and there's gonna be we're in this for the long haul right so yeah you don't need to i've been out i'm pushing it on days that i probably shouldn't have been and i've had some nice flights they've been pretty exciting and been too windy but um you know like there's there's no need to to keep pushing it because there are better days to be had
let's let's end on this one and i'll see you next time bye bye next one benjamin um what should beginners avoid trying
to run before you can walk really i think is is a good way to put it down just trying to do too much too soon um and not and sort of skipping steps you know and that's that can be hard sometimes especially when you're flying with people that are better than you and going places that you know are really exciting you want to go and and top landing in places that are hard to do and trying to do that before before you're capable um yeah don't run before you can walk and there's there's a there's a structured there's somewhat of a route to progression that people need to follow and it needs to be respected and you know you can't you can't you can't teach experience you know do the hours you know i mean i think a lot of people now are much better at not jumping up wing classes too soon um certainly here i think that's quite well respected um but yeah you kind of need to take it easy in the beginning because that's when you you're really most vulnerable because you you don't i've had you say this on the podcast a number of times you don't know what you don't know um but yeah i mean and when you're close to the ground that's when you're most at risk so take it easy like i i broke my back last year um and that was that was really stupid it was completely complacent um it was the most minor of back breaks that you can get like i managed to sort of walk away and fly out but um yeah i had a pretty rough landing and um just trying to force it in and when you're close to the ground you can you can really hurt yourself so
you're just top landing were you on a bivy then or yeah
yeah so i was on a bivy flight um really nice forecast i was pretty excited um i was set up to go for three days i was in one of my favorite parts of the of the island and was planning to go and sort of fly up past mount kirk and i got stuck in the on the naaman range which is on in the hopkins and i decided that i was gonna i was gonna slope land and camp there for the night um which in hindsight was probably not the best move because it was three o 'clock and there's still plenty of day left like i probably could have chosen somewhere else but i found this really cool campsite and it was right on a cliff edge beautiful grass like someone had moaned it like it was awesome and i really wanted to land there um but if i didn't land there because it was on a cliff edge then i'll be down in the valley floor and to get back up would be hours of hiking so i kind of forced myself into this i pushed too hard and um i overshot it um and i well i've i was overshooting it and uh instead of you know i could have totally just gone up and slope landed and put my glider in some bushes and it would have been a pain in the ass but it would have been totally safe um but i just start flapping in i start flapping in and i'm i'm loaded i'm i'm right at the top of the range maybe even slightly over and um and i you know you flap in and sometimes he just goes into little parachute or when you lose three meters and it's all good but this time it didn't it spun and um my legs went up glider went back and i just landed in the flat of my back like on the top of my torso um so skipped all the protection and just really not knocked the wind out of me um so i fell from like three meters just onto my back um i was super winded laid down for for for a bit for like half an hour thinking oh maybe i'll just get better i'll camp here and i'll keep going tomorrow and that slowly realization um didn't pan out so i decided to
i could still fly um and this is a mistake and this is if this is a takeaway for anyone like i should have in hindsight should have hit my sos my inreach um hands down and if i was put in that same position again i would have just hit it but i was in a sort of a state of denial more than anything like it's january it's the middle of the season you know i'm having a great time and i i don't want to be injured so i kind of like refuse to believe it so so i'm not so i'm not injured it didn't happen right you can walk this off um so i flew i i managed to fly
and i was able to fly
off and decided i was going to fly down and uh go down to the road and get myself out of there and it wasn't it wasn't until this is stupid because there's so much stuff going through your head at the time i guess and it wasn't until i took off again then i'm in the air and i'm like oh what if i have another bad landing i'm gonna be really stuffed you know and that's that's the reason you should you know like i can't i couldn't have walked down and i could have just hit the button and the services here are really great you know there probably would have been a helicopter
charge you it's an emergency they just take you out and take you to hospital and it was a no-brainer i should have done it and luckily i had a good friend jesse dew aka the retrieve king came and picked me up he drove for hours so yeah thanks jesse for that he drove up and picked me up and i went to hospital the next day yeah funny story yeah so yeah no sorry i've got to put this in i got to the hospital because i i just had a sore back and i slept it off and i took some painkillers and i thought well i should go i still pretty sore i'll go into the hospital and i'll get it i'll get it checked out and um i walked in there and i said you know what what happened you know i've you know had a hard landing on my paraglider and obviously i've got it on video so i show them the video and uh they're like oh that oh that was pretty you should lie down lie down i'm like all right i'll lie down like do you want some painkillers i'm like oh no i'm not too bad but yeah okay i'll have like give me some painkillers and painkillers and they go right we're gonna get you an x-ray and they x-rayed me and i came they came out the x-ray place and they
in and they're like don't move yeah like do not move lie down don't move your neck like and i'm like getting up and looking around going what do you mean but like lie down don't move so all of a sudden i'm really worried you know i'm like well what have i done and they go you've fractured three vertebrae in your back and uh you need to get a ct scan immediately so just don't move and i'm like jeez i walked in here am i gonna go out in a wheelchair like what do you want about like i you know i walked for hours i'm i'm pretty sure i'm okay and i got got the ct scan done and they came back and they're like oh okay so you you said you broke your back before right i'm like no they're like oh well you have because one of those is old and two of them are new or is it two of the two are old one one of them's new two of them are old uh well i'm like i'm like oh really you're like yeah yeah two of them we had a specialist look at them and yeah you've got two fractured vertebrae that are that are previous
and yeah no flying for a while but i'm like they're like have you taken some wax before i'm like well yeah i guess i mean skateboarding and snowboarding and you know i've crushed my speed wing once but no more than i'd had to like sit anything out but the doctor thought i was some kind of lunatic that's just been shrugging of spinal fractures and carrying on with life you know like so that was a bit of a shock or a surprise but yeah funny story yeah yeah
i've heard quite a few like that where you know you'll come into the hospital and you'll you'll if people will you know say what's happened and they'll say okay we'll just sit over there and then you know then they come running out even before the x-ray because the doctor wait what was the what was the cause of the trauma wait a minute they were paragliding no they can't don't tell them to sit down get them on there get them lied down yeah
yeah it's funny i'm like i'm glad that
worked out there's a really good there's two really good lessons there's
a really good lesson there's a really good lesson there's a
one is from my own experience i had a pretty bad crash this spring before the X-Alps here on a bivy i was training for the race and and i've put this in the show a bunch of times so i don't need to redo it here but you know when i crashed i was so thankful to have my first aid kit because you know i could i knew it was going to be hours before i could get help and i could calm myself down one i had oxygen which most people aren't going to have it you know we do here because we get so high that was nice and then having the first aid kit was great and
then i was able to
just be able to moderate the pain that i knew what was coming yeah just to help you know keep everything calm obviously the inreach was totally key you know i would have been completely hosed without that yeah that was also a really good lesson um and then the other is flapping you know i i'm still just shocked when i see my 20 in 2015 i top landed at and and sebastian huber and i did the exact same thing i top landed at and i did the exact same thing i top landed at and i did the plan FAI and it just pissed you know i just i had just bombed out on the backside on an epic day and uh and climbed up really fast and launched in a bunch of stinging nettle so i was in a bad mood and i and it was a really good day and so i wanted to land and get away immediately and the first time i blew it i was too high and went back out and tried to come back in it was you know it's anybody knows plan FAI i mean it's that famous launch above anisee but it's pretty narrow surrounded by trees so i had to get out of the way and i had to get out of the way and i had to and there's a lot of wind coming in.
It's directly coming in. And, you know, you could do, back then we didn't even know the fly on the wall move. I'm not sure I would have been able to do that there anyway with that much wind. But, you know, I've seen Maxime do it on his Instagram where he just comes in there and just stuffs it. It's amazing. But man, you blow that, you're in a major, you're in a lot of pain. But anyway, I forced it and spun it late. And luckily I was low enough that it was a non-event, but it's same kind of same as Sebastian Huber did. But I think we forget when we're flapping that we're getting down, you know, each progressive flap, unless you let the wing completely fly again, which, you know, the acro pilots are really good at. And that your ground speed is terrifyingly close to stall speed.
And you forget that. And it's just, it feels like all that pressure is there, you know, each time. And so. And suddenly that stall point, and it's usually a spin. That's what usually gets people. That stall point is much different than what you know it to be. And I learned after that, watching Carluccio at the Menarca in Mexico one year, you know, those guys, he learned in, in Card, no, not Cartagena, Caracas in Venezuela. And they've got to put when their landing zones are usually surrounded by barbed wire, and they're tiny. And so they've got to literally come in over the top and just come in like a helicopter. And, and I, I finally learned how to properly flap watching him by, he would basically completely go into tail slide.
It was, it was that deep of a flap, just full stall and, you know, snap the wing way back, but then completely let it go again, you know, just completely let it. So it's, it's, it's constantly going from not flying to fully flying before he, you know, he's going to fly. He'd hit it again, rather than these little like tink, tink, you see everybody do. And they're really dangerous, those, you know, and I, I really thought I had flapping down and watching that video is, is terrifying because it's just, what was I thinking? You know? So it's really something that's so good to practice with a ton of height and really, you know, like you're doing with acro and stuff. And I'm sure that's what caught you too, is, you know, you're trying to force it in.
And I'm just going to, I'm just going to come straight down here. And I've got to keep, we've got to keep our pressure up.
Totally. Like for that whole situation, I've got absolutely nothing to blame except myself. And it's totally avoidable. And my, my approach to top landing now is totally different. And I rarely, I very rarely use that technique anymore. And I've found alternative methods, which I think are a lot better. And I think it's taking like what we see, um, Chrigel and Maxime and Patrick, doing these incredible, um, speed landings. Downwind
uphill. Yeah,
totally. Which is really impressive, but I mean, we don't have to all go full blown full, full bar nose down in flying the wall landings, but use that same technique to a lesser level. And it still works really well. You know, just, it's like when you're flying tandems, you need some energy to get a good flare. And if you can use the same sort of, um, thing when you're, when you're top landing your solo, at the very least holding break, this is the batch, you the worst top landings and the most common mistake I see people do is that they're flying in with lots of break on lots of break, lots of lots of break and then boom, they flare and they stuff it in and it hurts. But if you're holding break and you can just let it shoot, build some energy pops up, flare boom, beautiful. I mean, it's all about having a good approach, but yeah, flapping, I, I, it's a really hard thing to do well.
And it's a fine line that you run between stalling your glider and, and smacking in on your back, you know, like it's,
it's a really hard thing to do. And I think, I think that the tricky part there too, is even if you do practice with a ton of height and you're, you know, in, in more of a quote unquote controlled environment or an SIV or that kind of thing, you, that's different than when you add the perspective of the ground, you know, when you, when you add the ground and the postage stamp that you're trying to do it in, then suddenly it's, you know, you, you may have the pretty good muscle memory of doing it at 3000 feet over, but when you're, when you do it like that, it's just, it's very easy to just quickly go, holy shit, I've overshot like what you did, you know? So, yeah, it's, but that it's a great lesson because there's so many times where we get, I've done it a million times myself where you get fixated on a spot where you just, you've got the exit still.
Totally. Fuck
it, man. You missed it. Yeah.
Go again, go somewhere else, you know, and land somewhere else. And that's totally it. And, and that's something that I fell victim to, because I have a so fixated on landing in that one spot. I wanted to land there and I'm going to land there. And I just completely forced it when it wasn't possible. And the only way to get in there was to stall the wing, which didn't go well for me in it. And it's fun. So like, just go and put it on the slope in a bush and pull your glider out. You're going to walk away from it. You know, there's no point in forcing it. And it's so much better to go around, have another go land on the slope somewhere. Like it's, you know, trying to put it on a flat spot where it looked cool. It's just, yeah. And that's the thing.
You know,
you know, you know,
you know, you know, you know,
you know,
you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, flying very slowly because they're flying in a lot of wind. So they've got a lot of pressure in their wing and they're flying slowly. And so they, you just forget that that relationship is not the same when you don't have the wind. And suddenly, you know, well, why did my wing collapse? I was flying the same speed that I normally do. Yeah, but you didn't have the airspeed. And so, you know, pressure's an important thing. Like you said, having that, you know, having flare authority means having energy. You got to have energy. I think energy is incredibly important in aviation. Totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Benjamin, great place to end. Thanks for sharing that story with us.
Glad that didn't work out too badly. And it sounds like that was a pretty good ending for all that and got to have some laughs about it in the hospital, which is good too.
Yeah, yeah, no, it didn't turn out too bad in the end. I spent a couple of weeks hanging up in the harness at home and nothing. I was back to it, but yeah.
Just more editing time.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that's it. Yeah, I could do with some more of that. But no, thanks, Gav. Thanks for having me on. Honestly, I'm honored. And please, if you come to New Zealand, hit me up and we'll go do some bivvy flying. It's just spectacular. I'd love
to, man. Your videos are just phenomenal. We'll have all that in the show notes for all of you listening. Please go check them out. They're really amazing. I loved them. And have fun in the Alps and on your trip to the UK. Thanks for sharing your time, man. I appreciate it.
Thanks. Awesome. Cheers, man.
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