Hi there, everybody. Welcome to another episode of the Cloud-Based Mayhem. Got a great show for you today, but before we get into it, just wanted to thank you all again for your donations. All we ask for is a buck a show. What we have learned, however, is that PayPal takes a nice big chunk out of that. There is no better service, at least that I'm aware of, and if there is one, please let me know. But we're using PayPal for these donations. No problem when the donations are a little bit more, if they're bigger numbers, but when they're a buck or two bucks, because they take a transaction fee as well as a percentage, that transaction fee basically means your money's going to PayPal and not to the show. So assuming you don't want to do that, I'm assuming that PayPal probably makes enough money as it is, it's better to kind of save this up and send us a bigger chunk of money after you've listened to a few episodes.
Or if you want to get away from that, you can do that. If you want to get away from the guilt of listening to a few and realize you haven't spent anything or sent us anything, of course you don't have to. If you can't contribute to the show, I totally understand, would just ask you then to share it. That's the whole point of this is getting out knowledge. So put it on Facebook or Instagram or wherever, you know, tell your friends. The whole point of this is to share this incredible, incredible information with our flying community. Still taking questions for Bill Belcourt. I'll be going down to Salt Lake here shortly. He's actually leaving for Cleveland. Columbia. So I'm not sure I'm going to grab him before then, but at some point we're going to connect and he's going to host a show just dedicated to answering your questions. So if you've got a cool question or two for the Yoda of the sky, send it through to me on email or through the Facebook page and I'll get that down to Bill.
Joanna DeGrigoli, some of you who pay attention to the paragliding scene probably noticed a couple of weeks ago, Joanna went huge in Brazil from Quixada. She landed just less than two kilometers. Short of the female foot launch record that Seiko did about a year and a half ago down in Australia. So huge flight. She beat her personal best by, let's see, 260 kilometers, I believe. No, sorry, 240 kilometers. So massive flight for Joanna. But this show is we recount that incredible flight, which is spectacular and awesome. But it's a lot. It's about a lot more than that. We talk about her beginnings and how she got into it. The treasured stories of, you know, wanting to become a bird when she was a kid.
And she learned in Caracas. Joanna grew up in Venezuela, lived there until very recently. Things have gotten so bad politically in Venezuela that she's recently moved to Annecy. You've probably seen her work in Cross Country Magazine. She does all the translation for the Spanish version, which Cross Country just launched this last year. She just got done actually translating my Alaska article. So I'm looking forward to seeing that. But, yeah, we talk about some really. Terrific stuff in this flapping really hard to get in, a.k.a. How Carlos does it, who she's one of her mentors down in Venezuela. Her first cross countries selling her violin so she could fly. There's not many people I've had on the show that chase it as hard as Joanna.
And and she's had to be really creative about how she does it. She's nailed some huge sponsors over the years. She's been a Gen Gen team pilot for quite a long time. Had a really scary accident down at Superfinal in Colombia in 2013, where she walked away unscathed incredibly. So some really good stories here and some really heartfelt, deep and sometimes pretty hard stuff. So I think you're going to enjoy it. We get off to kind of a slow start, but stick with it. Yeah, an amazing, bold, big, adventurous woman in a tiny little package. I love having women on the show because they. Just are so much more free with how they their perspectives and their emotions and how they deal with what we all deal with.
But they're a little bit more honest about it. So I think you're going to enjoy this. Without further ado, please enjoy my conversation with Joanna. Awesome
to have you on the show. First off, huge congratulations. We're going to be talking about your flight, I'm sure, here at some point. But why don't you tell me, are you still down in Brazil? Are you are you celebrating or where are you at?
Well, first of all, thanks for having me here. It's a it's an honor. And well, I'm in Canada right now. I'm in Ottawa. I stopped by to visit my parents and sister live here. And then I'm going back home to France and well, yeah, I'm celebrating. I'm so overwhelmed about my my flight. And I'm basically resting after waking up every day at five in the morning, going to bed at nine. Or. Driving the whole night and I missed my flight in Fortaleza. So I had to sleep at the airport, fly the whole night to Canada. So I'm basically resting.
Yeah. Chasing records is hard work, isn't it?
Yeah, it is. I mean, I I've heard the stories, but it's not until you're there and you you fly and you come back home and you drive the whole night on the dirt road that you you know what it is. But.
And do you did you guys hire chase teams and that kind of thing? Or how does it I haven't been to Brazil. How does it work down there?
Well, I before I left, I went over to Seiko's to have dinner and she and Pierre, they recommended me this guy called Paolo Rocha. He he offers this service that you hire him, you pay every day and he follows you on a map. You have you have to have a spot, of course, or the norm. And he follows you and he coordinates his drivers to follow you. So right before you land, he already knows you've landed. Of course, you push the OK button. He knows where you're at, but they're following you real time and they know where to send the drivers. So it's really well organized. He he knows his thing. And it's only three pilots per car.
So it's not like you're retrieving a bunch of people and he organized himself. So. Yeah. For example, my my two big flights, I was coming back home on my own with the driver. So it's not like one guy had to, you know, put up with to to retrieve someone else further and then drive the whole night with me. And so it was it was very well organized. It was it was great.
Was this your first trip to Brazil?
Yeah, my first ever. I've been wanting there wanting to go there for ages, but I must admit, I was too scared to go. So I mean, I saw the videos on takeoff of people getting, you know, blown away and push flying backwards and everything. And I was I was kind of scared. And and also it was always at the end of the year. So I always run out of money from like my sponsors money. I already spend it all. So this year it was different because I was going to go to them to the European Championships as in non-European. But that was full. So they couldn't take non-Europeans. And then I was going to go to the Spanish Championships and that got canceled because of airspace issues.
And so I said, well, this year you have the money and, you know, woman up and I like that. I've never heard that woman up.
That's great.
That's something Bill and I came up with once flying cross country together and say, OK, woman up and just go flying somewhere. I mean, I
love it. I love it. OK, so you you touched on quite a few things there that I actually want to circle back to comps and for sure your big flight and this this your your PB, your record. But before we go there, I understand I kind of want to get back into your history a little bit, because I think a lot of our listeners may not know too much about it. But you're I understand you've just recently moved to France. You're in Annecy. Is that right?
Yeah. Yeah, I'm from Venezuela and I just moved to France because maybe, you know, the country, Venezuela, is a bit of a mess right now. Yeah. So I finally decided to move to to France. I work with Cross Country magazine and in charge, I'm in charge of the Spanish magazine. I'm a translator. So, yeah, I've been flying competitions since 2002 and competing internationally since 2005 and nonstop competing World Cups, World Championships. And, well, lately, a little bit less of that, but still, I'm still trying to stay in the competition scene. And, well, of course, I love cross country and I can fly as well.
And where were you when you were in Venezuela? I imagined you were hanging out with Carlos quite a bit. Is he still there? Were you in Caracas?
Yeah, I was in Caracas. And you mean Carlos Cordero? Yeah. Yeah, we used to fly in the same place. In Caracas, in a place called Oripoto, which is great because you fly next to the city and it's next to your house and you can do, like, very short triangles and conditions are really great. So, yeah, it's a great place for training and the top landing is technical. So and there aren't that many landings around, so it's a it's a great place for training. So, yeah, we we used to fly a lot there together.
I had an underappreciation for what how you could fly.
I mean, I don't know if it was the World Cup or the Superfinal a couple of years ago. I can't remember. But Carlos came into the same place. He was flying the the old Superfinal Ice Peak six, you know, the black and green one that they that that first year, a beautiful glider. And and I mean, I thought I knew how to flap it. Man, that dude flaps. It was like, yeah, he and he told me he was learning. He's a master. Oh, my. It was it. And actually, after that, I started practicing that maneuver, but with height, not right near the ground. I would just do it up in the sky and, you know, like really stalled it and then opened it up and then stalled it. And I got a really new appreciation. And he said he learned that from from having to land in these tiny little yards in Caracas.
Yeah. And that's that's how we top land in Noripato. You just come and you just flap your glider to stay in the same place. And I mean, I think. I think if you fly in that place, you really learn the limits of your glider. I mean, how much you can break it. And I mean, you need to know how not to stall a glider. And that's a great place for it, because, you know, if you stall it, then you just, you know, you you fall in a few meters high and and you can get hurt. So, yeah, he's a master of that. I remember that that glider, we call it the Black Pearl.
Perla Negra, we call his glider. And you could hear hear the plastic inside. I mean, how it used to sound. And also when he had the the R10, it was the same thing. You could hear the plastic bending inside when he was flapping. So, yeah, he is he's the master flapper.
The master flapper. Yeah, he absolutely is. Your your name, Grigoli. What what what what kind of name is that?
Grigoli is an Italian last name. OK. My dad is from Italy. He was born in in Palermo, in Sicily. And he migrated to Venezuela with with his family when he was 11 years old. So, yeah, I could say half Italian. OK. Well,
I could I could spend the whole rest of the hour talking to you about Venezuela. It's a very dear, precious place to my heart. I've done quite a bit of sailing there and quite a bit of overground travel back when things were a lot different. It must be just devastating to see what's going on there. I don't know what to say about that. It's just terrible.
Yeah, it is. I mean, it's it's a beautiful country with great weather, great flying, great people. And I mean, it just I was the last one in my family to leave just because I didn't want to leave. And then I had to think with my head and not with my heart to, you know, to know that I was missing a lot of life because I was living there. And I said, well, someday I'm going to be old and then I'm not going to be able to do some stuff like hiking, flying and maybe cross country flying. So or maybe I won't want to. So now that I'm young, I'd like to, you know, to do that. And here in Venezuela, I can't at the moment. So, yeah, it was heartbreaking to leave and now to see my friends and family struggling there to get basic stuff like toilet paper.
But I really enjoyed it. I really hope someday it will be the country used to. And who knows? Maybe go back. Well,
I look forward to I didn't know you were doing the Spanish translating for the magazine. I look forward to reading the article in Spanish. My Spanish has suffered in the last few years because I'm not spending much time and in Latin speaking countries. But that'll be that'll be fun. I didn't know you were doing that.
Actually, I translate your Skipper column all the time. And now at the moment, I'm working on your Alaska article, which is I mean, I'm totally overwhelmed from what you did. And it's amazing what you guys accomplished. It
was really kind of Ed and the editors to run it so long. I was surprised that, you know, I wrote that originally for the Patagonia blog and it was quite long. And Ed said, yeah, I want it that long. But just add a bunch more flying. Really? You want it longer? So, yeah, I'm sorry that you have to translate such a long article. It's such a long piece. I
mean, it's a it's a pleasure when when I translate stories like that. It's just like, you know, you get the chills and everything because you get into into the adventure. And because when you're a translator, you had to you have to try to transmit not only, you know, not only translate the words, but to for people maybe who know you and who speak Spanish and English. That when they read my article. That when they read my translation in Spanish, that they can imagine you talking. So it's not only translating and making it work in Spanish. It's also trying to translate the personality of the author into Spanish. So, yeah, I like that. It's a challenge.
Well, especially it's easier when I know the person. So it's great.
Yeah, I was going to say, well, I'm glad it's you because you get to you translate all the little, you know, the skipper columns. But, you know, we've got a little bit of history. And we know each other. And that's great. Let's dive into that. I would love to hear how you got into flying, when you got into it, what the impetus was. And and take me through a little bit of your progression and training, because I know you're you're you're super passionate about it and you're getting after it. I know you're flying for gin. Can we tap into some of that stuff?
Yeah, sure. I mean, for me, flying is something that began since I was born. I mean, when I my mom, she would keep my my drawings. And, you know, when you used to just scribble things that, you know, used to draw and things didn't make sense. My mom, she used to write on on the back of the of the of the page where what it was and everything was something that flew. It was a flying boat. It was a flying train. It was a plane. Wow. So I used to draw about flying up since I was a little a baby. And I was just marveled up about everything that flew. I used to say that when I wanted to grow up, I wanted to be a bird. And my mom, she had to explain to me that I can be a bird, that I was going to be a woman, but not a bird.
And then little did she know. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And then when we when I was like three years old, my parents, they took us to a trip to actually to California. They they rented a camper van and motorhome and we drove all over the place. We went to the Sequoia National Park and we went to all these cool places and we went to this place to this beach. And I'm not sure if it was Torrey Pines because my parents, they don't remember. But there was a guy who was going to take off on a hang glider. Unfortunately, there wasn't enough wind for him to take off. So he was just maybe assembling or disassembling his glider. And my mom, she told me that she explained to me that that guy was going to was going to fly on that thing.
And she told me that I just went like, what? That it was too much for me to handle as a three year old and that I understood what she told me. And I was just amazed about that. This guy, this guy was going to fly on this thing made of metal and tissue. And so after that, I became. I became obsessed about hang gliders and everything was about hang gliders and skydivers and stuff. And then I when I was like nine years old, I started seeing from my house. I started seeing paragliders and I said, what is that? Is that that's not a parachute. And I remember we were we were driving on the highway. We're going out of town and this guy lands next to the highway. And I was like, Mom, what the hell is that?
And is that a parachute? Well, that doesn't look like a parachute. It's something else. And then I found out that was a paraglider. It was a guy flying from Loma Lisa, which is a famous cross country site in Venezuela where they did a couple of World Cups a long time ago. And he had just bombed out. But I don't know what he was doing. Now, now that I understand, I don't know what he was doing there. But anyway, I was just amazed that you could do that. And then I started. Of course, there was an Internet at the time. But I started seeing on TV. And. And I saw this guy, these people putting paragliders in their backpacks and walking. I was like, wow. And since I'm so tiny, I'm only a meter fifty five.
I'm five one. And I'm really tiny. I said, I mean, a hang glider just looks huge. And this looks so big. This looks so cool. So as I grew up, I was completely obsessed about it. And of course, I did a lot of a lot of sports. Always. I was into gymnastics and basketball. And athletics. And I sucked at all. But I really liked sports. And so. So anyway, when I was 17 years old, I was on my last year of high school. My school, they took us to a trip. It was like a four day trip. And at this they took us to some camp. And there was a guy.
He he was a handball player. He was a hand glider pilot. And he was like, no way. No way. You're flying. So he told me, yeah. And he gave me the phone number of a parent in school. And I still have that piece of paper that this guy gave me. So when I came back home and I said, Mom, look at this. This guy gave me the phone number of a parent in school. I already called. And the course costs this much. And it's about this and that. And he said, well, there's no way you're going to get my permission to. To take paragliding lessons when you're of age and with your own money, you can do whatever you want. But now it's no. So I was kind of disappointed. Then I remember there was they had a they had a wind tunnel close to Caracas.
And my mom said, well, that maybe maybe you could do that. So after that, after I graduated from high school, I went to the U.S. for a year as an exchange student. And I lived with the family. And it was a great year. But I never forgot about flying. I was still obsessed about it. And when I came back home, I remember I said, well, Mom, I really like to go to the wind tunnel. And she couldn't believe that I hadn't forgotten.
Let's take you to the wind tunnel. So unfortunately, they closed it. And so I couldn't do it. But I was still obsessed about it.
Then I all the time, like every year, every few months, I would call to the U.S. The paragliding school. And I would hear how the price of the course was increasing. And I said, well, I'm 18 years old, but I don't have a job and stuff. And so finally, when I was 21, I was able to gather enough money for the course. And I mean, the first weekend, I mean, you just ground handle. But the second day of the course, I remember it was maybe 11 in the morning. So there were a few bubbles already on the ground. And I remember I was groundhand. I was running with the glider. And the thing would just lift me up maybe half a meter or maybe less.
And just the feeling of being lift up. And I said, OK, this is it. This is my thing. I didn't need to do a tandem before. And it was just that feeling of being lifted in the ground. It was so magical that up till now, 16 years later, it's still my favorite part of paragliding. I'm going to take off. So yeah, I totally got hooked into paragliding from the first day or maybe the second when I got lifted up. And from then on, it was just a fever. I mean, it was just something that my body needed. I needed to go flying every weekend. At the time, I had a boyfriend. He was a vet or he's a vet.
And he could only go flying every other weekend. So I told him, well, you know, I need to fly every weekend. So with or without you, I'm going to go flying. He wasn't very happy about that. But I needed to go flying. And it was finally a sport that I felt that it was my thing. And I was progressing very fast. Of course, I always try to keep it safe because I knew the risks. And I said, well, and I remember my instructor, he told me, this is something you need to find your own pace of progression. And you need to go slowly. Otherwise, you can get hurt. So I took that seriously. And, you know, of course, women, you know, we have a special self-preservation instinct that's very mysterious.
And maybe that makes us, you know, go slower. I don't know if I'm wrong. But at least that's my case. I took it very seriously, very slowly. And I progressed. Maybe I was too conservative. Maybe I'm still too conservative. But that was my way to do it. And then two years later, well, I discovered cross country. And when I started thermaling, I felt like… Did you discover
cross country in Caracas? In Venezuela?
No, I couldn't fly in Caracas at the beginning because since it's such a technical flight, I remember that they let me do like a little sled ride in Caracas. But I was flying in El Jarillo and Placibel, which is an hour and a half from Caracas. And I remember the first time I took a thermal and I could see beyond the mountain. I mean, what there was behind that mountain. I said, wow. So they told me, yeah, you can go places. And people fly distances. And I started reading. And I said, wow, this is cool. So I remember I felt like caged in that place. So I went to another place. And when I was able to go from one thermal to the other, I said…
This is awesome. Then when I was able to go to the next ridge, I said, well, this is the most amazing thing. So once a friend of mine told me, would you like to go cross country? And I said, well, that sounds cool. But, you know, I flew two years without a barrio. And he told me, well, to go there, you need a barrio because we need to tell you more or less what height you need to cross some places. I said, okay, well, let's get that barrio thing. I got a barrio. And I remember I was in my car. And I switched on my car. And I said, well, this thing makes too much noise. What the hell? I mean, how can people fly with this thing? It's so annoying. So I remember I flew with it. And on my first flight, I flew like 15 k's.
And I was just… I landed. I was just jumping. It was so cool. Of course, people were flying their competition gliders and stuff. And I was on a June Bandit, the HV2 of the time. And… But that was a great glider to progress. And I flew 15 k's. And on my third flight, my third cross country flight, I flew 44 k's. And, I mean, I just couldn't believe it. I said, this is so cool. You just go and you land somewhere you don't know you're going to land. And you have this little adventure when you land. You meet people. Of course, in Venezuela, adventures are a little bit hotter than some places. I mean, you have to be careful. But still, I mean, you would meet people. You meet farmers. And you have this little…
You go up on a horse and people help you on a motorcycle. And I said, this is my thing. Then I started competitions in 2002. I mean, I wasn't… I didn't want to get into competitions. But then people said, well, you know, you learn a lot from other people. And you push your limits a little bit. And I said, okay, let's register in this competition. So… But I was really frustrated. Because at the time, they were making, like, these really long tasks. And, like, the first turn point was, like, 50 k's away. And I'm like, I've never flown 50 k's. How am I going to get to the first turn point? So, I was frustrated. I said, well, we flew. I mean, I don't know. I remember how many tasks. Maybe three or four tasks. I mean, I'm… The competition is over. And I didn't even get to the turn point.
I don't like… I don't like competitions. I don't want to. But then, well, everybody was doing competitions. And I said, well, it's fun to hang out with these people. You get to meet a lot of pilots. And then I got hooked. Yeah, I got hooked. And it's like… I got addicted to it. And then I started to fly well. And I said, oh, look at this. Finally, a sport. I can do something. And in 2005, I did my first international competition. It was the Rolls-Royce Open in Colombia. It was a pre PWC. I… I was first. I was first female. And I was 23rd overall. I was flying a gradient Aspen one at the time.
And I wanted to… There was a world championships that year in Baladares. Were
you… Let me just jump in here real quick. Were you… Were you working something else? Or were you… How were you… How were you traveling? And were you just couch surfing, dirt bagging it? Or did you have another job? And then you could go paragliding when you weren't working? Or how… How were you… How was all that kind of fitting into it?
Well, I started college pretty late because I had really bad grades in high school. So I didn't start college up until the year 2000, the same year I started paragliding. So I went to the university and I was teaching English. I was… To kids. I was working as a tutor. There were these kids going to bilingual schools and they had a lot of homework in English. So I was tutoring them. And so in the mornings I went to college and then in the afternoon I was teaching. So that's how I could afford paragliding. So… But to go to Colombia and, you know, I studied music for a long time. I sold my violin to go to Colombia.
And my mom, she just… Oh, man.
That's a big move.
Yeah, because I wasn't playing anymore. I switched to playing the mandolin. So I said, well, mom… I'm not playing the violin anymore. Can I… Can I sell it? And she said, well, okay. But then when she heard that I was… That I sold it for… To go to a competition, she got mad. Yeah. She thought I was going to sell it, I don't know, to do… To get a better car or something like that. Not to go fly. But it was good. So I went to Colombia and I remember at the end of the trip I ran out of money. I didn't have… I couldn't afford the hotel. So a friend of mine, he had to lend me money to do it. But at the time, since I wanted to go to the World Championships and all the registration fee was $500, I said, well, that I can't afford, plus a plane ticket, plus a hotel, food, whatever.
And I said, well, it's… I'm going to go look for sponsors. And everybody laughed at me. They said, well, are you crazy? What do you think you're doing? Soccer? This is paragliding in Venezuela. You're crazy. I went out to look for sponsors and, you know, every day on the phone, like crazy. And I didn't find anything for Brazil, but I didn't quit. I'm very stubborn. When I want to get something, I just, you know, I do whatever it takes to do it. And so I didn't give up. I mean, I'm like that. When people tell me, no, that's impossible, maybe that encourages me more to do something.
So that year, 2005, I wanted to go to Europe after the World Championship, and the World Championship was very frustrating. Frustrating because after winning in Colombia, I was like, yeah, I'm good, I can do it. And I go to Brazil, and everybody's in their comp gliders, and I go to the World Championship with a DHV2. I mean, what am I thinking? And I go there, and I bump out the first day, like in the first turnpike, and I was like, what? And I remember one day, I bump out with Nicole McLearn from Canada, and I have this on tape, and she said, well, you know, I thought I was actually good, and then I come here, and reality hits me that we suck.
And I felt like that, but I remember that image. We bumped out together in the middle of nowhere, and she tells me that, and I'm like, yeah. So that was a slap on the face. And I said, oh, that's reality. So you still have a long way to go. You have to get a better glider, and you have tons to learn. That year, I wanted to go to Europe for a competition, and I managed to go to the Czech Open. And there was a pre PWC and a Czech Open in Slovenia, and I managed to get Red Bull Venezuela to sponsor a plane ticket for me. And unfortunately, the weather was bad. The weather sucked, and we flew like one task in three weeks.
Yeah, it was horrible. They all got canceled. They all got stuck. So yeah, I went to that competition, and it was frustrating because I couldn't do anything because of the weather. But it was a great experience. I got to meet people, and I got Gradient to sponsor me. I met André Dupas from Gradient on that competition, and well, I told him that I wanted to progress and do comps, and he sponsored me a glider. So a few months later, he sent me a glider, an AVAX XC1, which I did amazing things with that glider. That glider really got my confidence up, and I managed to progress really fast with it.
I did nice flights with it. I did a record in Venezuela. I flew 98 kilometers. Wow. For me at the time, it was like, ooh, cool. From then on, then I really quit my job, and I said, well, if I want to find sponsors, I need to focus on this. I was dating a guy who then became my husband, and he was very successful at finding sponsors. He was an ultralight pilot, and he was sponsored by the oil company, by North Face, and he flew expeditions on his trike. He flew all over the continent, from Venezuela to Argentina, and then back up to the U.S.
and back. And he's Venezuelan? Caribbean. Yeah. And well, he helped me a lot. We met because of that, and then we dated. We eventually got married, and well, slowly, I started building myself a name. I worked really hard, and I met people from the media. And I learned how to market yourself, and to deliver, to make news. I went in 2006, I remember, I went to Monarca, and that was an amazing experience. I got the strongest thermal I've ever got, 11 meters per second, I'll never forget.
Proper Valle flying.
Yeah. And well, then I started flying World Cups in 2007, and that's when I really said, well, I need to do this. I need to progress. And that was a big level competition, and I think I wasn't ready for World Cups yet. And I didn't have the glider, I was still flying my AWACS. After that, it was World Cups, World Championships, and I managed to get sponsors, and I managed to not live, but survive, as sponsors, and I got big brands like the phone company, Ford, and Nestea to work. They sponsored me, but I was never making any results, and I was, like, important ones.
I would, let's say, win like Spanish Championships, and Nordics, and do some stuff here and there, but I would, I never did anything important in, up until 2010, in which I, that was a year my husband and I split up, and I just took all the money I had, and I bought a plane ticket. And I flew every single competition that I found. That year, I went to Chilean. That was my first World Cup podium, and - And
that was the year. I mean, that's the one when you talk to Russ, and I mean, you talk to everybody about that. That was before my competition time. I was flying then, but I was running a boat around the world back then, so I wasn't around much. But the 2010 World Cup. That was the year, right? That was the one they all talk about with the, you know, coming back into goal at the soccer field. You know, the sun was going down on the last day. Isn't that the one?
Yeah. I remember that day, that, yeah, people were, I didn't make it to goal, but I landed, like, right on the edge of the rim, but that was a magical week. I mean, we had great tasks. The organization was great. And - Mm. Awesome. And
I won it.
Yeah. It was really amazing. And that got my confidence up after a shitty year of a failed marriage.
And that was the year I got Gene to sponsor me. I talked to him, and I said, well, you know, I've always wanted to be in the Gene team, and I really admire you, and I feel the Gene team is a little family, and I'd like to belong. Mm-hmm. And he said, well, sure. Do you have some time to come to Korea? And I said, yeah, I'll find the time. And I went to Korea and I spent a magical month there. Jin designed me a prototype for me. He was working on the Boomerang 8 prototype. And since I was a little scared of two liners, he made a three liner prototype, which was an amazing machine. So far, my favorite glider ever, because, of course, it turned the way I wanted.
It climbed the way I wanted. It did everything the way I wanted. And he had amazing performance. So after that, we went to the Superfinal in Turkey. And well, I didn't do so well. That really changed my life. And, you know, Jin, he's a guy, he has a special magic. And he can really make you feel special. And that was a great month for me. And that lifted up my spirit because I was going through a crappy time. And then I went home after all those months traveling. I was traveling for five months. I went to every single PWC that year in China, in Korea, in Japan, in Italy, in everything.
Everywhere. In the Women's Open, which was a lot of fun. And what else? Spanish Open. You name it. I did it last year. That year. In January of the next year, of 2011, I still had that super cool glider. And that was the year of the first PWC in Colombia. So I got there the week before. I had to fly the road that opened. And, well, I did really great. And between... In that road that opened, the PWC, I learned that my husband had died. He crashed in Ecuador on his ultralight. And, well, we were still married and in contact.
So we were going up the hill on the bus for the training day of the PWC. And I got a text from a friend telling me the news. And I just felt like my world fell apart. I was finally getting out of the hole, of that hole of splitting up. And then I just fell back again in the hole. While I was dealing with that news, I remember going out of the... When we finally got to take off. And, you know, I was... All my friends were around me and I just didn't know what was going on. I would just... I just couldn't believe it. I was trying to understand and trying to figure out what to do, if I should go back to Venezuela. Or if I needed to go to Ecuador.
I had no idea what was my role. And I remember that I told my friends, you know, you guys go fly. I mean, just go fly. I mean, it's... That's what we're here for. I don't feel like flying, but I'd like you guys to go flying. And while I'm there crying, I remember seeing gliders flying over me. And I realized, you know, the world keeps spinning. I mean, the world's going to stop. It's not going to stop spinning. Because your husband died and you feel like shit. So I said, well, you just keep going. I mean, you need to keep going. And a friend of mine, Raul Pencil, I remember he told me, I mean, why don't you just stay? I mean, he told me, I know we're not friends, but why don't you just stay?
And I said, well, what am I going to do home? I'm just going to go home and cry. So I'd rather stay here and fly, if I feel like. Or watch people fly. And I remember Xavier Murillo, he told me, well, you can go home. We can refund your entry fee. I said, no, no, I'd like to stay. I mean, at least here I have to get up because I have to do something. And if I go home, I'm just going to get depressed and maybe sleep the whole day and cry. And that's not going to take me anywhere. I stay there. I flew every day. I landed when I felt like I wanted to land. Yeah, of course, I didn't do anything. As a result, obviously, I think it was a good idea to stay.
And then I went home and had to deal with that. And, well, of course, 2011 was not the best year for me. I also lost Ford as a sponsor. But, of course, I mean, I didn't give up. I said, well, I need to keep going. And so I kept going, flying, competing.
And then 2012 came. And, of course, in 2011, we had that problem with the gliders. I got my boom 8 and I flew it like maybe 10 flights. And I really liked it. And then the accidents happened in Pietra 8 and I got scared. After that, I said, well, I don't want to fly this glider. I mean, it hasn't done anything to me, but maybe two liners are still, like we say in Spanish, in diapers. They haven't evolved much and they still, the designers are still maybe figuring out how they work. So I think I'm going to wait a little bit for this technology.
So I took a GTO one. And, yeah, that was a fun glider to have. But then the Superfinal came in January. That was a hard Superfinal. People were struggling. People with the Boomerang X were stretching their lines every day. People already had the ENSOs. The girls, we didn't have anything. We were all on GTOs, Mantra 4s. And I remember the frustration of the girls and of many pilots in that competition. Either because their gliders didn't work or because they didn't have a glider. And, of course, it was Valle. You know, it's a lot of pressure and it's rough. And that was kind of a special year in Valle. It rained and that was the first time I saw rain in Valle.
So, well, that was a real... That was a really bad Superfinal. Actually, I didn't fly the last two days. Yeah, I wasn't feeling well. I mean, I kind of was like, you know, when you deal with depression, you just go up and down, up and down. It's like a roller coaster. And Valle was a low part of it. In
this stage in your career, so kind of 2010, 2011, you're dealing with your ex and the death. Were you flying? Were you flying a lot outside of competitions as well? I mean, it sounds like you're so passionate about flying. Is it... Or was it really... Was most of the hours you were getting in comps?
No, I went flying every single weekend whenever I could. And sometimes I didn't feel like flying, but I enjoyed being there on takeoff and watch people fly and talk to my friends. I needed company. I really needed company. And I said I knew that I... It wasn't... Healthy to be alone. I said, I mean, it's better to talk to your friends, talk about flying, cry a little, have a beer.
So, yeah, I was going flying or at least to try to fly. But then in 2011, after that Superfinal, that very frustrating Superfinal in Valle, I was feeling a little bit better. And the cross country season was really nice. I flew 100. 160Ks in Venezuela. That was a big, big flight for me. And up until now, that was... What? Are you
serious? Yeah.
That was my personal... 160 to 400. And I flew it. Yeah. And I flew it in 2011. Oh,
my God. And... I can't wait to talk about Brazil then. Yeah. Yeah,
you smashed it. Holy shit. That's incredible. Okay, go ahead. Go ahead. Wow.
Yeah.
So, yeah, that left my spirit a little bit to break that record. And, of course, in 2012, I went to Europe and I competed. That year, I got Nesty as a sponsor. And that was huge. That was very huge. You know, you felt important. They had, like, a media person just for you. You got a lot of branding material, like T-shirts and stuff. And that was really huge. And that year, I was third on the PWC in Macedonia. And I think that's been the hardest podium in my life. Because it was a great week. We flew... I think we flew every day. One test got stopped and one test we didn't fly.
So, I think we have, like, five tests. And conditions were good. The level was high. I mean, all the girls were there.
Claudia, Petra. Yeah. Seiko wasn't there that year. And, I mean, the level was really high. And I remember I was... I screwed up the first day. I got my Boom X for the first task. And I remember launching on it. And I said, it's a GTO, but faster. It's a GTO, but faster. Just think that it's a GTO, but faster. Because I never change.
I'm very conservative. So, for example, I never fly a new glider on a place that I don't know. For example. Or I don't change two things at the same time. I would never change harness and glider at the same time. I don't know. That's something that I learned. That you shouldn't change too many things. So, because, you know, I don't believe in luck. And I believe that luck is a number of variables that you can handle. So, if you know the glider. If you fly in conditions that you can handle. You're going to fly well. It's not a matter of luck that you had an accident or that you don't have an accident. That's at least what I believe. So, I got that glider.
And I said, well, you're going to fly in a competition. I mean, you've never done that. But, well, it turned out okay. I said, well, at least you know the place. It's not a turbulent place. It's not a super strong place. So, you're going to do well. I was bummed out on the first day. And I got intimidated. And I remember thinking that day. I said, well, what's going on? You've been here for a week. You like the place. So, are you going to get intimidated because you're flying with all these World Cup pilots? I mean, come on. Just push the bar. And so, I remember I said, from task two on, I was like on it. I was pushing. I remember Richard Gallon, he came and he said, take it easy. Don't go out on your own.
Just stay with us. I was fifth up until, I think, the second to the last day. On the last day, I did really well. I said, well, maybe I can climb up to fourth. I'm happy about that. The prize giving was like an hour away. And I was in my room. I was like taking a shower, changing, just surfing the net. And I said, oh, let's see if they publish the results already. So, I go up on the results and I see that I'm third. I was like, what?
I remember I got on my bed. And I started jumping. I was just jumping on my own. I wasn't even screaming or anything. I remember I had my phone in my hand. And I was just jumping in my bed all excited. And I couldn't believe it. I said, I did it. I remember I called my best friend in Venezuela. And she started crying on the phone and said, I'm so proud of you.
Persistence pays off. Yeah.
That was a major high. Yeah. So, 2012, it started pretty bad. But it turned out pretty good. And then 2013, I went to the Superfinal in Colombia. And, I mean, I enjoyed the Superfinal. And we were there. And it was the last day. You remember they didn't want people to fly in the fire. So, the last day, they sent us through the mountains. And I was so tired. And I was doing so bad in the comp that I remember I was flying with Petra, who was also doing bad in the comp. And we were just, you know. Giggling in thermals and yelling at each other and then laughing. And we were just enjoying our last flight in Colombia. Just flying, not competing anymore.
And we were in the mountains late in the afternoon. And it was rough. It was strong. I wasn't having a good time. And I said, well, should I go land? Okay. Just go to the next turn point. Next thermal. You're with Petra. Just stay with your friend. We were climbing in these six meters per second. And we get up to cloud base. She goes out first. And I go out next. And I remember we're climbing six meters per second. And I have my brakes in my hand. I was like, okay, okay, okay. And then all of a sudden my glider just blows up. My left wind tip stays open. I try to counteract the turn. And I push. I pull on the right brake. And I try to pump the left side.
But, of course, there's no pressure because I have maybe 80, 90 % of my glider closed. And all of a sudden I feel like I get pulled like a puppet, like a marionette. And whenever I have blowups, which they haven't been much, but whenever I got a frontal, I remember the first thing I do is I grab my risers so I don't get twisted. This was so violent that I couldn't even grab my risers. And I got tumbled over the glider. While that was happening, I was like, really? Is this happening? So I said, well, so this is what an infinite tumble feels like. I tumbled over the glider and I fell on my back. I mean, it's not like, you know, you fall like Superman style.
No, no, I fell on my back.
And when I fall, finally I get twisted in like one, two million times. And I started spinning. And I said, okay, time for a riser. I'm going to test my beamer too. So I started spinning really fast, but it was like right from the first turn, it was really fast. So I reach for my riser and I can't get it out. So I tried to pull it really fast and it starts spinning faster and faster and faster. And I started pulling and I started getting worried. I said, oh my God, it's not coming out.
Because you couldn't. Because you couldn't. You were just in a position where you couldn't pull it very hard or there's something wrong.
Well, there was something wrong. I pulled the handle, but the package wasn't coming out. I started getting worried. So I said, okay, try to untwist. So as soon as I lift my head up, the G-forces, they locked my head and I couldn't get twist because I had like the middle twists. And I said, okay, let's reach for your line cutter. So I say, well, if I cut maybe one part of the glider. It's going to start spinning slower and maybe I can get my riser out. I couldn't reach my line cutter because, I mean, I just couldn't. It was next to my shoulder, but I just couldn't get it out of the thing. So I tried it for my riser again. Nothing.
I tried to get my other hand and, of course, I can't reach my riser with my left hand. So I said, well, game over. And I know it's really high. I remember when everything started, I was like 2,800 meters. And although we were over the mountain ridge, it was still pretty high. So, okay, okay, it's over. So I remember I crossed my arms and I said, well, let's wait for it. I just hope it doesn't hurt. And I started thinking, oh, my God, my brother's birthday, it's in two days. Oh, my God. My best friend is going to get married in a few months. All these things started to go through my head. And I said, oh, my God, I always said that this wasn't going to happen to me.
That's what I always promised my parents. But I can't do anything about it. I even thought, should I get the GoPro out and say something? No.
Oh, my God.
That's how long it took to come down 1,000 meters spinning.
Wow. So I
remember I just stood there and I said, please, please, God, don't. Don't. I hope it's just one wham. I hope it's just one big wham and then it doesn't hurt. And I couldn't look down to see how far I was. I knew I was far, but I didn't know how far I was. So I couldn't brace and say, three, two, one. No, I couldn't. Because I couldn't see how far I was from the ground. Yeah. And my head was locked back. So I tried to reach my chin and I tried to move my head, but I just couldn't. And whenever I took my arms out, they would just fly away because of the G-forces. It was really violent. So finally, I feel these branches.
And I remember I start reaching for branches, maybe to slow the thing a little bit. And then I just hit the ground. And I'm like, I'm alive. Okay. Let's do the check. Okay. Fingers, check. Toes, check. Legs, check. Okay. Wait a few seconds. Back. Okay. The back doesn't hurt. Okay. I can stand up. So I remember I stood up. I took all my harness, everything out. And I'm sitting on a dead log, on a trunk, on a dead trunk. And I mean, it was a dead tree, actually. It was laying down and I was sitting there half a meter from the ground. And I stay up. Of course, everything's still turning.
And I remember I looked at my instruments. I had a C-pilot at the time. And I said, okay. And I said, wow. The screen didn't break.
You know? Because I mean, that was after that impact. You know how fragile C-pilots are. And I thought the thing was going to destroy it. And I was surprised that nothing happened to me. And not even my C-pilot broke.
Did your wing get hung up as you went in? Well, apparently,
there were very little trees, maybe two meters up. As I came in, my handle, it must have got stuck in a branch. And I was like, oh my God. And the reserve got out. So, I was looking at it. I was trying to understand what that was. I go, okay, that's my reserve. It was partly hanging out from the container. So, it didn't get deployed. It just got out. And so, I said, okay. Now, it's a good time for you to come out of a harness. I remember. So, everything was okay. I just had a splinter in my finger. That's all I had. Then, I remember I took the radio and I said, oh my God. Petra sold that. And I said, oh my God. So, I take the radio out. And I said, Petra, I'm fine. Keep flying. And she was like, what the hell?
Keep flying. Where are you? I don't see you. What happened? Oh, she didn't see anything. So, I said, well, I'm in the trees. But I'm fine. So, you just keep flying. And she didn't hear someone. Then, I heard a male pilot. I don't know who he was. He said, she says she's fine. Just that you should keep flying. Then, my phone rings. It's Nikki Moss. And she said, I just heard a thing on the radio. Are you okay? Yeah, yeah. I'm fine. I'm going to take the radio out. I'm going to change frequency. And I'm going to give you the coordinates. So then, these people, I heard this yelling in the forest. And so, I said, hey, I'm here. So, these guys come. And they're part of a rescue team who had their base on the mountain. And he said, well, we're sorry we didn't have time to put our uniforms on.
Only one of them had his uniform on. He said, no, we're part of a rescue team here. And we saw you spinning. So, we just ran. The trees were so big. So tiny. I mean, so young and so, I mean, so short, so little that they didn't even have to cut anything. We just bent the branches and took the glider out. That's how.
Unbelievable. So, I
remember we put everything in the backpack and we walked to the road. I was five meters from the road, from a dirt road. Of course, if I hit the road, that would be a different story. So, everything happened so fast. These guys, they took, I mean, I was out of the forest in 10 minutes.
And I talked to Chris, the retreat guy from the PWC. And I told him, well, I asked them, is there a bus or anything that goes down to the valley? And they told me, yeah, the bus should be here in half an hour. So, I said, well, don't even come and pick me up. I mean, it's going to take a long time. I'll just have someone meet me down in the valley. So, these guys, they got me on the motorcycles. And they dropped me off. They dropped me off in a little store. I remember I got a drink. And that's when it hit me. That's when I just broke into tears and everything. I just realized what just happened. And then, well, I remember a friend of mine, Andrea Jaramillo from Colombia. She wasn't flying in that comp. She was working. And she told me, well, you want us to meet you there so you don't have to go back with a random retreat driver.
We go back in a girly car.
So, she had another pilot that picked me up. And, yeah, I came back. And, you know, it was too much to handle what just happened to me. So, that's something that really marked my flying career. And I think my flying was never the same after that. Because after that, I really wanted to fly. But I remember going to take off at home and crying because I wanted to fly. But I was just too scared to do it. So, I would just do, like, sled rides late in the afternoon. And I wanted to step down to an easier glider. But at the time, there wasn't anything. Gene was getting the Carrera out. And they didn't have it in my size. So, there wasn't anything that I could fly.
Yeah, so I didn't know what to do. But I said, I don't want to stop flying. So, I remember I went to the PWC in Baixo Guandu in Brazil. Every day, I would just panic. In the air. Really panic. And it was really strange. Because three weeks after the competition, I went to a competition at home. And I flew really well. I was flying. I said, well, this is great. The accident didn't affect me at all. But I don't know what happened. After a few months, it really affected me. And I was totally panicking in the air. In Baixo Guandu, I was just flying down every single day. And I was wishing I could push a button when I was in the air to just push a button and be able to fly. That's how scared I was. It was really, really hard.
So, I remember when I came home. One day, I was driving and my phone rang. And I got this strange phone number on the screen. And it was Jin. I said, Joana, we just certified the Boomerang X-Alps. And I think that's the perfect glider for you to heal and everything. And I just sanded. Sanded. So, finally, I got the glider. But it was in September. And that glider really hurt me. It really helped me heal. It was an easy glider. It was a different glider. And the feeling of a light. I had never flown a light glider before. Light material. So, I remember flying that glider. It really helped me. Just the way it moved. The way it absorbed turbulence. And how easy it was to launch and to fly.
How un-demanding it was. Finally, I felt like I was coming back to my flying. The year later. The next summer. I was in Slovenia. In Italy, actually. The last day after the competition. We went for a cross country. With Isabel Messinger and Steve Etherington from the UK and I. We had this magical flight. We took off from Italy. And we flew north. And apparently that route is not very common because of the wind. But that day there was a very light south. So, we flew north. And it wasn't a big distance. It was 75 kilometers. But it was so magical. And we flew over these amazing mountains. I remember Bella told me, You're back.
When we landed, we were just happy and hugging and everything. And she told me, You're back. And I said, Yeah, my confidence level definitely went up a notch.
Do you still, since that time, does that accident still haunt you? Or do you really feel like, You kind of turned over a new leaf there on the flight with Bella? Was that the end of it? Or do you still really kind of battle with that fear? No, I
still battle with it. I mean, it comes back. And sometimes I feel good. And sometimes I don't feel that good. I mean, that flight really changed me. I felt like I was flying better. But every now and then, I still feel that that accident haunts me. Now I'm like, when I fly high, I say, Okay, I'm high enough for the reserve. That's what I'm thinking now. Sometimes if I don't have a good motivation to fly, if I don't have a plan, I get scared. I don't know why. I get bored. I get scared. And I want to land. It's really strange. So usually, every now and then, I have to battle and I have to say, Okay, keep going. Go to the next thermal. Go to the next ridge.
I have to set myself straight. I have to set myself short-term goals in order to fly. Or I say, Well, just try to stay in the air for 45 minutes. And then after I'm in the air for 45 minutes, I say, Okay, now let's make it an hour. So yeah, sometimes I battle. And I really haven't figured out why it comes and goes. Yeah, it's really strange. And people have told me that they honestly thought that I was going to stop flying. And I say, Well, why? It's just the thing I love the most in life. And why should I stop flying? So I just battle with it. And I remember that the Federation at home, they said, Well, they weren't going to support me anymore because they gave us like a letter so we could ask for permission to buy foreign currency at home because it's forbidden.
So they told me, Well, we're just not going to support you anymore because you're not fit for flying. I said, Well, just then if you really want to help me get me a shrink, get a sports psychologist who helps me deal with it. And they didn't do it. So I had to deal with it myself. And I had to find my own therapy. And that really helped me, that therapy. Still, I have to battle. And I don't know if it'll ever be the same. And I don't know if, for example, now I ask myself, since I haven't been able to fly a comp glider for so long, because I'm so small, I say, Well, do I really want to fly those gliders anymore? Because now I have a GTO too. And so I don't know. But yeah, it's definitely something that comes back to you.
And it's something that I have to deal in every flight almost.
There's kind of a recurring theme with, thank you for sharing all that, by the way. Some of that's pretty heavy, but I'm glad you did. I think that one of the really recurring themes that we have, with guests that have been around, that have flown for a long time, everybody has a scary story to tell. I mean, that's paragliding. And coming back from it has been, I think, different for everybody. But there's these two common threads that are fear on the one hand and fun on the other. And it's been stressed over and over again that if it's not fun, it's not worth it. And fear is one of these where it seems like we need some fear, because that's what keeps us alive.
You don't want to be fearless, but too much fear can really... I've personally seen quite a few really pretty bad accidents when... And of course, it's always 20-20 hindsight, isn't it? When you look back and you think, God, yeah, but they shouldn't have been flying. They were flying really scared. So it's... Yeah, I think there's enough and then there's too much, isn't there?
Yeah, exactly. I've always told people that when they ask me, people like non-pilots, that they ask me, aren't you scared? And I say, well, today I'm not scared. I'm not going to take off. Because fear is what helps you see reality. You have to use it in your favor. And you can't allow it to be against you. Because if you have... If you're too scared, you're going to panic and you're not going to react accordingly to the situation. And as you say, if you're fearless, you're going to put yourself in a dangerous situation and you're going to get hurt. So I always say that fear is my ally. And then when I saw that I was panicking in the air, I said, well, this is not good because it's...
I could also get hurt because then I would panic and I don't know how I'm going to react.
Well, let's make a jump here. Just because I want to be mindful of your time too. But so your longest flight until a week ago was 160K. Exactly. And then you go to Brazil. And I read with fascination, you did a little kind of a blog post on it. It sounded this, you know, sometimes I think not to knock flatline flying at all, but sometimes those days just line up and the cloud streets are... They're amazing. And, you know, but I haven't flown Brazil, but I hear stories, you know, I did the chasing the flats numbers down in Australia a few years ago. So I know exactly what you're talking about in terms of it's an endurance run.
It's really hard. You know, you're up all night driving home and then you're up in the morning early, especially in Brazil. You know, but I hear stories from the guys do it, you know, trying to get the record in Texas that it can be pretty daunting terrain. But it sounded like your flight was... It wasn't just a, you know, get out of the terrible windy launch, which I've seen horrendous videos of. So I understand why you were pretty scared to go there and fly that place. It looks terrifying. But it didn't sound like a, you know, a slam dunk. It sounded technical and difficult at times. And yeah, replay the flight for us. And again, congratulations. It is not every day we get to fly 400 km.
Yeah. Well, I mean, I got there the first day and I just said, well, I'm going to go for a test flight. I said, I'm just going to go for 100 km. And I ended up flying 306 km. And that was a perfect day. That was
your first day? Yeah. The
first day was 306. Wow. And because I just kept going, I said, well, let's just break your personal best. Well, let's make it 200. Well, let's go 250. I said, what the hell? Just keep going. Stop. Stop thinking. Just keep going. And that was an easy, perfect day up until the end that there was some rain. Actually, I stopped. I could have flown maybe 350. But I didn't want to land anywhere or even get close to the rain. So I landed at 306. Then I did 222 flights. Then another 93 km flight. And then,
346. And then a very… And this is
all Quixada?
Huh? Yeah, all Quixada.
This is all Quixada? all Quixada.
So the last day started really different. The driver was late. And we got to take off. And it was cloudy again. And I said, well, maybe it's not a great day, but let's say goodbye to Quixada with 100 km flight at least. So a guy say, an Italian guy said, he said, I love you. And I looked at the weather. Today looks like a 400 km day because the wind is going to get stronger. So I recommend that you take off early. So I go off early. And I noticed that it was windier. I mean, the takeoff was perfect. I mean, it was, I think, the best takeoff that I had the whole week. Although I had a little cravat, but it didn't get blown away. So, but, you know, we saw up to the cloud.
And I said, well, I'm flying backwards. Okay, let's push bar. It looks windier than the other days. So, okay, just be patient. After my bomb out a few days before, I said, well, just don't go out that early. Just be patient. Sebas Ospina from Colombia. He left really early and I didn't hear from him. Then Kevin, I think his last name is Philip from Switzerland. I saw him leave and I saw him work a little rich. So I said, well,
okay, So when Brett Sangling left, I left behind him. And we worked together the first bit and it was beautiful. The first bit was great. The clouds were kind of big, but it was working already. So we followed this, this cloud street up, up to Kishar Mubim, which is about 30 Ks from takeoff. And then the day started opening up really well. And we continued up to Boa Viagem, which is about 70 Ks. Then there, there was a lot of wind. So I, it was a blue hole. The clouds ended there. And I saw the Italian, some guys, some Italian guys landing. And I said, well, maybe it was their first day there. So they didn't know it. And I said, well, maybe they didn't, don't like it that there's, there are no clouds and they didn't know where to go.
I didn't know where anywhere else was. And I said, well, I'm just going to keep going anyway. It's the last day. Why not? So after Boa Viagem, I go, I go to the ridge and as I'm going to the ridge, there was, there's a query and I saw the dust is blowing horizontally. And I said, Oh, it looks windy. So I go to the ridge and I try to climb and I can't catch the thermal. And whenever I face the wind, I was flying backwards. And I said, okay, I don't like this. Okay, let's just fly away and let's land in the next valley. And, uh, as I go, I said, well,
it's windy. And I said, well, if I fly backwards, I risk, uh, landing on the tree. So, well, I find a thermal. It was horrible. It was turbulent. It was very badly organized, but I, I was climbing. So I just climb and I drifted. I don't know how many Ks, but I drifted quite a bit up to the next ridge. And I said, okay, let's try the next valley to land. And I see that I'm flying backwards even faster. My, my GPS was telling me minus 10 Ks an hour. Okay. And I said, okay. I didn't know you could have negative numbers in your, in your map. Thanks Navitor. Yeah, I've never seen that. Thanks Navitor for that info. So, um, so yeah, I said, okay. I said, I think it's safer that you stay in the air and the day seems like it's working.
It was completely blue. There were some clouds, but they were really far away. I said, okay, but it's, the day is working. So just try to stay in the air. So, well, I go in the next thermal and then the next valley and it was the same story just just you know assessing the condition seeing if it was if it was safer to land or to stay in the air and it didn't look pretty then I finally made it to the flatlands after a hundred case and it looked worse every time I was looking at the conditions it looked worked out worse I was flying faster when I was tailwind and I was like 90 Ks an hour and I when I was facing the wind I was in in negative numbers so I said well okay now it's a flat one it should be less turbulence just keep going so I go in the flatlands and I keep flying and it was slightly better but in terms of turbulence
but every time I hit the inversion it was this really strong inversion and you could see it and it was really bumpy at the inversion and you couldn't break it once you broke it in some thermals it was slightly better yeah so I keep going and in the flats and it was still strong turbulent until I remember the name of the town but it was kind of like the the end of the when the 200 K mark is there's another like a little plateau that begins at around 220 so I get next to the close to that plateau and I hit a really low point it's okay you're done you're gonna land you're gonna fly backwards okay get prepared it's plenty of room and there's a little hill and I go to the it was the lee of that hill because I go on the front and there's nothing I go to the lee and I find this nasty thermal I mean I swear it was horrible that the glider was just you know when you you can't center the core because it's so windy and you don't know it's drifting and the thermal is not letting you in it's literally like that finally a vulture saved my life he he he saw me he said okay come on you rookie this is how come
here so I went for the vulture was and I said thank you little Walter I'm gonna make you a statue someday
so I threw with the vulture and I climbed really high higher than the other thermals and I said well let's go to the plateau it's usually less windy there so I'll just go there and there was a major fire on my line I said why why a fire where I'm going I mean couldn't you burn the thing somewhere else okay be a woman go so I go but I said I'm not gonna get in the fire there's got to be a fire I'm gonna get in the fire there's got to be a fire there's got to be something around the fire it was like fortunately was like that next to the fire I found the it was maybe a two meter up well I thought it was a two meter up but it was a two meter away because the thermal was climbing he was drifting horizontally these fire I swear it was like a football field big in that fire like that it would normally go up you know the smoke
there's that much wind wow There
was so much wind that the smoke was completely horizontal. Actually, one of my photos I posted is a video grab, and you can see the smoke that is horizontal. So I said, well, just drift with this thing until it's over. That's when I got my fastest speed. I looked at the GPS, and it was 100 kph tailwind. I cried.
I cried, and I said, I don't want to land here. Please let me drift with this thing. And, yeah, I realized that it was in a situation that it was out of control. I never felt that vulnerable in my life. I mean, I've always felt little when you fly, sometimes when you see this huge landscape and you realize you're a tiny little feather or a leaf.
Yeah, just getting blown around.
Exactly. But I never felt vulnerable. And here I felt this is too much for a paraglider. I mean, if I had a hang glider or a sailplane, I mean, it would be more manageable. But this is too much for a paraglider. So, well, it's beeping. So there's a Spanish pilot called Chechu, and he says in Spanish, si pita giro y si no tiro. It means if it beeps, I turn, and if it doesn't, I push. So if it's beeping, so I'm going to keep turning. So I drifted that thermal for maybe 40 kilometers up until a plateau ended. Whoa.
Yeah. Just frisbeeing along.
Exactly. Exactly. That's a good term, frisbeeing along. Up until the plateau ended and there was a valley, the mountains were beautiful. I said, I want to take pictures, and I can't. So I was just trying to enjoy the view. Well, I was surviving. Finally, I made it out of that place because it was a valley that was kind of narrow. I made it out of that place, and there I was about 270 Ks. And then I looked at my GPS, and I was cruising at 70. I said, well, that's better. 70, not 100, that's better. So that's when things started to get better. And then I looked at the time, and I said, hey, I think you can make 400, because... Sebas Ospina told me that Rafael Saladini recommended him that he should be at 200 at 12.30.
So I was at 200 at 1.15, so it was too late. So I said, well, just fly as far as you can to fly away from this wind. But then when I was like 270 and I looked at the time, I said, well, maybe I could do it, so just fly faster. The thermals got better there and nicer, and better organized. I finally hit 3,000. And I said, well, just don't screw up. Keep going, don't screw up. So I arrived here. I remember 306 that I looked at. That was my first good flight in Brazil. And I kept going. And there were some clouds really far away. So I said, well, you know this place, this area, you know it already.
You know where to go. So just keep going. So I was enjoying these thermals. And when I got up to 3,000, finally I was able to eat. Finally I was able to drink, to take the camera out, to take some pictures. And yeah, when I was gliding, I was going like 70, 60. So
now you're having just pure fun. Yeah, now
I'm finally having fun, enjoying the view, making decisions as where to go to make the flying longer and not landing. I remember a hit. It was 380. And I said, well, do you still have like an hour to fly? So don't screw up. And I went to the small fire and it worked really well, but not really high. I was maybe 2,500. And I was like, oops. I didn't expect that. I thought I was going to go up higher. So then there were lots of fires. So I said, you just jump from fire to fire. And you're going to make the record.
It sounded pretty easy in theory. Well, since that thermal was over, I go to the next fire. And when I got there, there was nothing. And I was like, no way. I mean, the flames were, when I got there, the flames were getting bigger. So I think I was, I arrived at the end of the cycle and too early for the next one. Yeah, I went all over the place, behind the smoke, on the side of the smoke, and nothing. So I said, well. This is the end. So just glide and find a safe place to fly. I remember I was flying over a river. It was beautiful. It was just, you know, wading all over the flats. It was really beautiful. And the sun was hitting it, so it was like a mirror.
And everything's so dry there. And especially this year that when I saw that amount of water, it was like, wow, this is pretty. So I remember I said, well, just get directly there. Just get the tailwind. Just get your. Go as fast as you can. Yeah, the wind in your butt and try to fly as fast and as far as you can. So then I just relaxed and I was flying along the road. So it was perfect. And I saw this field and there was another fire. And I said, well, maybe I would find something that would drift me and maybe. But no, there was nothing. And so I just said, well, I enjoyed my final glide. And I chose a field. And around it, there were other fields.
But they had more trees. And I said, well, you don't want a tree landing on your last day. And you're not going to break the record. So just land in a safe place. I said, well, if I break the record, I don't mind landing on a tree. But you're not going to break. So I just go. And I swear, it was the longest glide of my life. Because the GPS was showing me 398 forever. Then 399 forever. And I was like, come on. And I was looking at the ground. And I said, well, you'll have to turn around soon because there's a house in this. We won't be able to make it any further. So as soon as I said 400, I said, well, you have a few meters. So I kept going a few meters. I turned around. I faced the wind. I had a perfect landing. Wow. I just couldn't believe it.
But you know, it was strange because I had mixed feelings. I was super happy about my flight. I just couldn't believe that. I had just flown 400 k's. I was really happy to be safe in the ground after such extreme conditions. But I was upset that I was so close to the record. Because maybe if I'd flown 380, I'd say, well, I was still far from the record, 22 k's. But being only 2 k's away, even less than 2 k's, it was like 1 k in 100 meters or something like that. Wow. It's so close to the record. It's
100 meters of better climb than your last climb. It's just nothing, isn't it? It's just so close.
Exactly. So yeah, I mean, I think I've never landed with so many mixed feelings because you usually get like two mixed feelings, but not three. But then you say, well, are you stupid or what? You just flew 400 k's. Enjoy it. Enjoy it. And nice. And now enjoy whatever adventure is going to come and the people who's going to come and talk to you. So my first priority when I landed was getting rid of my diaper.
Ah, yes. Right. Of course.
And because, well, you know, I peed so many times it was a mess. So, but I didn't care. In the air, I was like, I am peeing and I don't care. Yeah. So these two guys, they come and they say hi. And I explained that I came from France. And they said, well, what's your name? And I said, well, I'm Kishida and stuff. And when I, when they saw that I, that I took my harness off, they started laughing. I was like, yeah, I know what you're talking about. So they weren't that interested. So I, before I saw many people coming, I just ran to the bushes and I, I changed my clothes and everything. And of course, Brazil and people in that area are the nicest that I've ever seen. Every day that I landed, people invited me to their homes, invited me to for lunch or dinner, gave me water, juice.
One guy, he gave me a bag full of mangoes and bananas. It was amazing. So I, I wanted to pack really fast because it was getting dark. So we packed and we got to the road and I just, you know, put my, my glider there next to the road. And this lady, she says, well, you know, our, our house is just across the road. Do you want to sit there and stay with us? I was like, well, yeah. And so they took us. They took a chair out. These guys, they live in a adobe house. It was, you know, made of dirt and they were really poor. But we got to talking and when they, I told them that I didn't know when my, where the, when the driver was going to come, said, so would you like some Brazilian coffee? And I said, of course I want some Brazilian coffee.
They got coffee out, cake out. This other guy, he came by bike and he was with a little girl who stood there and he didn't, she didn't say a word. I didn't say a word all the time that I was there. But then he told me, well, she just heard that you were a woman and she just wanted to see you. So when I was talking to these people, it was night already, but she was just staring at me. Yeah. But she was amazed that because she just came because she knew it was, she heard it was a woman. So she just wanted to see me. Finally, I asked her her name and her age and you know, she, she talked a little bit, but it was great. We were just staring at the star. It was completely dark. And, uh, we were, we couldn't even see our faces. We're just sitting there next to the road and we were looking at the stars and, uh,
and this guy was just telling me how much, how, how much he enjoyed living there because he was so peaceful that he, he went to Sao Paulo once and he didn't like it. That moment with that family, I mean, I think it's always going to stay in my head and in my, in my memory and they hugged me when I left and you know, it's just, it was just amazing. Oh, of course it helps that I speak Portuguese so I could, you know, the communication is easier. It wasn't just the flying was also the sharing with people. It never, it
never is, is it? It's a, yeah, it's, it's, it's, I think it's why we love going far cause getting home is half the fun.
Exactly. And I, I, I've gathered a bunch of stories and I've been planning to write a book about it. It's just not about flying after what happens when you land. Yeah. Because you know, of course, flying is great. It's an adventure. We get to see the earth from a unique perspective. But after you land, you need, you have, you don't know what's going to happen really because in the air, you know, okay, the glider is going to do this and if you know, you know how to handle a glider and how thermals feel, but you don't know what's going to happen when you land. So I think that's also one of my favorite parts of paragliding. The people you, you meet when you, you land. I'm overwhelmed because I don't, I never post anything. I don't post anything on Facebook. I have my athlete page and that's where I post things related to paragliding, but on my personal page, I never post anything.
And I just posted the track and I said, this isn't a, this has been the toughest flight of my life. And all these messages, I've been getting messages on WhatsApp, on Facebook or Instagram, everything. And I mean, they're genuinely happy about what I did. And yeah, one guy, he's, he really said a really authentic comment. And he posted, fuck Joanna, this is amazing. Congratulations.
Yeah. Well, yeah. And, and you, fuck Joanna, it is amazing. It was, it's, congratulations. It's, it's really cool to hear about the flight. And, you know, I think that it's just, you know, from my own experiences, going kind of, my, my big flight here was a few years ago. And it's, like you said, there's, there's mixed feelings about it all. I think it's very dangerous for us to, you know, to chase numbers, but at the same time, it's very rewarding and fun. And, and, but I, I can sympathize with the mixed feelings. And I mean, I think it's just so much more important, isn't it, for us to enjoy the process and, and, you know, the little flights as much as the big flights, because it's, it's a reminder of, you know, I think, I think if we get too, you know, if we, if we, if we chase these numbers too much, we lose.
We lose the beauty of the small ones, you know, and just, just the, just the stepping off the ground and, and going for a little sledder can be just as, just as precious, can't it?
Well, you know what that reminded me of when I was having all these mixed feelings is that when you get to go and you see this, all these sad faces and people throwing helmets around and kicking harnesses, that they just had an amazing flight and they're upset because they arrived late to go. And I said, yeah, I mean, don't worry. Don't do that. Just feel happy. And yeah, it was, it was very brief, but it reminded me of that, that when I've seen people do that kind of stuff, that they just flew up around these beautiful mountains and they, they flew around all these people and, and they're upset because they didn't make a good result. So yeah, I said, well, don't, don't lose the perspective. You just did something amazing and you had a great experience and be open what's going to happen in the next few hours.
And of course then the entire night, because we drove the whole night and we got home at 6 30 in the morning.
So yeah, I mean, you can't lose perspective. Even when you bump out, you just need to, you know, analyze your flight, learn from your mistake. I usually play back the flight in my mind and I try to learn from the mistakes. See, see what I did well so I can repeat it and see what I did wrong. So I can avoid it on the next flight.
Yeah. Well, great. Let's, let's end it there because that's great advice and it's, it's timely and it's true. And yeah, again, congratulations. So psyched for you. I'm sure you'll, you'll have that one in your little back pocket forever. And now, now you've got a much bigger personal best to beat. You've gone, you've gone from 160 to 400. So, so yeah. You're
amazing. You're
going to have to hunt a little harder, but, but I'm thrilled. But I like
challenges. Yes, of course.
Of course.
So I think it's going to be a great goal to try to achieve.
Yeah. Fantastic. Well, enjoy your time with your family there in Ottawa. And I look forward to seeing you this spring out in Annecy. That'll be one of the first stops as I prep for the X-Alps. So we'll see you in your new home. Very beautiful home. I think. I think if there was one, one other place in the world that I could live other than my little paradise here, it would certainly be there. So yeah. Enjoy. Yeah.
I agree with you. Well, I'm looking forward to seeing you there. Yeah.
Fantastic. Well, thanks Joanna. Thanks for your time. And thanks for sharing these stories and we'll talk soon.
I hope you enjoyed that. What a cool gal and a great conversation. I can't wait to fly with her again in Annecy this spring as I get ready for the X-Alps. Again, all we ask for is a buck show. If you enjoyed this or one of the previous episodes, and I implore you to go back and check those out if you haven't, or if you're just first, if you're just discovering the show, there's so much great knowledge there. I appreciate it. If you've got suggestions for about the show or ways we can improve or people you want to have on it, just reach out to me at cloudbasedmayhem.com. You'll find the contact page there, or you can reach out to me via email or Facebook or Instagram or however you want to do that. Some of you are who do follow me on Facebook. So I just put up an article about insurance. This is more related to U.S.-based pilots, but I put out some information in some of the past shows that, well, was mostly accurate, but the GEOS coverage, both the SAR and the medevac coverage that is offered automatically through Delorme and Spot when you sign up, both of those have paragliding and hang gliding exclusions.
And so I've written up a big article about what you need. Both when you're home and when you're traveling abroad. And we have an insurance policy through our boat, my other business, the Offshore Odysseys group policy that definitely covers paragliding. You don't need to be going on the boat. You don't have to have any relation with us whatsoever in terms of going to the boat. We're developing our own insurance plan also, hopefully with USHPA. And so that'll be dedicated towards that. But until that time, you're welcome to use this insurance policy. It's way cheaper than anything else you can get, at least than I know of. And it definitely covers paragliding. So go on to cloudbasedmayhem.com. You'll find that link on there. It's called Unscrambling Insurance. Are you covered? Check that out. Let me know if you have any questions. I hope that helps for your travels this winter or if you're in the Southern Hemisphere this summer.
And we'll see you on the flip side. Cheers.